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Thread: Fighting and self defense

  1. #1

    Fighting and self defense

    Saturday night I was walking in downtown San Diego and when I came up to a stop light some guy comes up to me and yells in my face "leave now, get out of here". I just calmly tell him to take it easy. I slow down as we proceed to walk down the street so that I'm behind him by about ten feet. Well he turns around comes right back to my face and yells the same thing and more but now he's getting some body language and for a second he reaches for his belt and I think the worst A GUN/KNIFE. I'm not armed but I watched his hands every second and when they went to his waist I thought I was going to have to kill him with my bare hands. Pause: It's been 18 years since I've thrown a punch and I think to myself "should I ?" My fight instincts are on big time and I just want to beat this guys face to a pulp but, inside I knew I would only attempt to wrestle him to the ground and make a citizens arrest. Well I didn't need to. After the second approach I gave a grizzly yell "Back the fu** off or I'm calling the cops, do you want to deal with the cops mother fu**er?" and he said "no" and backed off. I'm thinking of taking an Aikido class for self defense mainly because I want to be able to apprehend a potential threat, I don't want to beat somebodies head in the concrete, like I thought I might have to.
    ]
    So having said that has anyone taken self defense classes and have you used it in real life?
    Last edited by The Irish One; 14 Mar 2004 at 3:18 AM.

  2. #2
    Cyburbian Cardinal's avatar
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    My self defense class lasted eight years and was taught by the US Army. Hu-aaa!

    I only needed it once, way back when I was in college, though I did body check an agressive panhandler last week. I don't know that I would take on somebody, though I would certainly defend myself. A tip I would have is to hit hard and with the maximum force available to you. Don't be shy about using a rock, pipe, board, or anything else available to you. Convinve them that fighting you is going to hurt them, then either let them run off, or finish them off.
    Anyone want to adopt a dog?

  3. #3
    Cyburbian el Guapo's avatar
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    My top 10 list of street fights.

    1. Walk away when that is an option.
    2. Never seek a fight - but never ever submit to an ass kicking because you think they may only hurt you a little bit. They may decide to hurt you all the way.
    3. You are stronger than you think, and you can take more damage and survive more than you think. We have wonderful doctors and paramedics.
    4. If he has a gun you need to be in constant motion or behind something bulletproof. Better yet have a gun yourself.
    5. Know the difference between cover and concealment. One hides you from view -the other stops bullets. There is a vast difference.
    6. There are worse things than death.
    7. If you are not prepared to truly pummel someone to the point where they can’t even crawl away - don't throw that first punch.
    8. In a street fight -Fight Dirty - Your Opponent will.
    9. Don't count on strangers to lend a hand. They may be with your opponent.
    10. Always better to be judged by twelve than carried by six.

    11. Bonus - Ask for a Jury Trial! - If you have lived a clean life, when they drag you into court for beating the dirtbag nearly to death many people like me will see that you walk.

  4. #4
    Corn Burning Fool giff57's avatar
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    Forrtunatly, when you are 6ft+ and pushing 300#, most folks don't mess with you. So I don't have much advice.
    “As soon as public service ceases to be the chief business of the citizens, and they would rather serve with their money than with their persons, the State is not far from its fall”
    Jean-Jacques Rousseau

  5. #5
    Cyburbian Rumpy Tunanator's avatar
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    Seeing how I still don't have my pistol permit, I carry a knife and wear steel-toe boots. I once worked for a guy who was a tae kwon doe (sp?) instructor and when the place wasn't busy, he showed me some basic punching, blocking, and kicking moves. Maybe you should take some classes.

    On the other hand, I found this quite effective when walking alone: Act like you're crazy and do your best Simpson's immitation of Bill Cosby while flailing your arms around wildly. Usually works wonders and sends them the other way (It really works and have tried it).
    A guy once told me, "Do not have any attachments, do not have anything in your life you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you spot the heat around the corner."


    Neil McCauley (Robert DeNiro): Heat 1995

  6. #6
    Cyburbian Michele Zone's avatar
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    My brother took martial arts and used to try teach me some. I remember little of it. But I have a few random thoughts:

    1) My next door neighbor growing up had like 8 kids, 5 of them boys. The one you did NOT want to mess with was the smallest of the bunch. He learned to not back down from his four larger brothers and had false teeth in his twenties. He moved far away from home and became a respectable decent guy who was loathe to get into any kind of trouble. But if push came to shove, you really did not want to mess with this guy. Size is not everything.

    2) On that same principle, I once found myself being hassled by someone for the crime of not wanting to date him (or something to that effect -- I was probably 17, it was a long time ago). When I went for a walk one day, I ran into him at a store on a lonely stretch of road, surrounded on three sides by woods. I knew that there wasn't much I could do to stop him from kidnapping me, raping me, and worse (he was driving a van -- my life was kind of "flashing before my eyes"). Politely and quietly standing my ground without trying to further provoke him probably saved me an a$$whooping that day. Again, size is not everything.

    3) Like Card and eG said, if you take that first punch, know that you are "committed" and do not worry about things like "consequences". Your comments about taking aikido so you can "apprehend" someone suggest to me that you think too much like an "American" who grew up watching garbage like "The A-Team" -- where 5 million bullets could go down range without any blood spilling and The A-Team could apprehend their opponents against all odds, etc. The American mentality that we can go to war and have almost no one die, etc. is unrealistic, most of the time, in practice. Unless you are one of the top 10 black belts in the world or something, be prepared to do hurt or be hurt (actually both: you will do hurt AND be hurt most of the time).

    4) Do not carry a knife or gun unless you know how to use it and are prepared to use it. A threat means nothing if you are not prepared to back it up. If you aren't genuinely prepared to put it to use, you may be conveniently supplying your attacker with a weapon.

    5) Do not hesitate to pick up an 'equalizer' -- lead pipe, brick, whatever -- or "fight dirty". I have kneed at least one man in the groin who really deserved it. It doesn't take a lot of martial arts to fight dirty. This isn't a contest in good manners.

    6) Be "rude" earlier rather than later. Many people who are criminal count on "nice" people to excuse their "rudeness" and to try to continue to "be polite". Many women have been raped because they were not willing to say "NO, I do NOT want your help carrying in my damn groceries! And if you do not get lost, I will call the cops." Politeness can get you killed. If they are genuinely decent people, they will understand and not be offended at your reluctance to trust a total stranger -- or even a neighbor you don't know all that well. It is the "slippery slope". Do not start down it and it is harder for them to escalate things or maneuver you into a position that is "favorable" to them.

    7) As a general rule of thumb, you are in less danger in public view of many people -- but not because the onlookers will help. Mostly for "psychological" reasons: creeps don't want too many witnesses. Some pervert who took all kinds of photos of me in a bikini on the beach when I was 17 (and he must have been in his 40's) later offered to drive me back to my hotel. I actually accepted -- and had him drop me at the hotel lobby. Maybe I shouldn't have accepted at all. But when he offered to drop me at my room, I said "no, this is fine" much to his consternation. I am sure he thought he could manipulate me. lol. He kissed me on the cheek as I got out of his car, to the horrified stares of respectable people. I was sort of amused. If he had tried to rape me, these same good people would also have probably just stared in horror -- at ME, wondering why I would "let" a man do such a thing. Most people cannot be counted on for "help". They are too busy looking out for number one and "accusing" the victim so they can feel okay about it.

    I probably had other stuff to say but I don't remember what now. I got interrupted. If I think of anything else, you might hear more from me.

  7. #7
    Cyburbian JNL's avatar
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    TIO that's pretty scary but sounds like you handled it well. Glad you are ok.

    I have been thinking of taking a self-defence class, especially now that I will be travelling by myself. Haven't seen any advertised recently. Otherwise I just have a basic knowledge of vulnerable spots to go for if someone attacks you.

  8. #8
    Cyburbian Cardinal's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by JNL
    I have been thinking of taking a self-defence class, especially now that I will be travelling by myself.
    Watch out, guys, JNL is really coming over here to kick our a$$es.
    Anyone want to adopt a dog?

  9. #9
    Cyburbian JNL's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Cardinal
    Watch out, guys, JNL is really coming over here to kick our a$$es.
    Well I don't know about that, but it wouldn't hurt to have a few moves up my sleeve for fending off unwanted advances

  10. #10
    My toughest friends are under 5 ft. 8 in. I'm 6ft 3in and this guy was a little shorter than me. The second time the guy came at me was before another cross walk and plenty of people watched me act psychotic, when he reached for his belt area I came at him with violent intentions and he cowered immediately. I didn't and wouldn't underestimate myself -I struck back with verbal and physical authority that I'm certain scared the hell out of him and as for apprehending him I would have, sometimes you know what you can do, despite all those years watching the A team . Most American's I've known/ grown up with -have no problem beating the sh*t out of each other.

  11. #11
    Cyburbian Michele Zone's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by The Irish One
    My toughest friends are under 5 ft. 8 in. I'm 6ft 3in and this guy was a little shorter than me. The second time the guy came at me was before another cross walk and plenty of people watched me act psychotic, when he reached for his belt area I came at him with violent intentions and he cowered immediately. I didn't and wouldn't underestimate myself -I struck back with verbal and physical authority that I'm certain scared the hell out of him and as for apprehending him I would have, sometimes you know what you can do, despite all those years watching the A team . Most American's I've known/ grown up with -have no problem beating the sh*t out of each other.
    lol. You have to remember that I spend a lot of time on military bases, where there is very little violent social behavior: we save that for The Enemy. To each other, we act civilized.

    "An Armed society is a polite society" (I think Heinlein said that. But I wouldn't swear to it.)

  12. #12
    Cyburbian Plus Zoning Goddess's avatar
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    I have not taken a self-defense course but my dad bought me a handgun when I was in college and had one of my brother's friends teach me to shoot. His advice: don't pull it unless you'll use it, and if you shoot, empty the whole damn gun into the guy.

    But, if my gun had not been locked in my car, with a lock, in the the glove box, 7 years ago, I might be a widow instead of a divorcee.

  13. #13
    Cyburbian SlaveToTheGrind's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by el Guapo
    4. Better yet have a gun yourself.
    Just took my concealed carry class.

  14. #14
    Cyburbian Duke Of Dystopia's avatar
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    [QUOTE=Most American's I've known/ grown up with -have no problem beating the sh*t out of each other.[/QUOTE]

    I have a theory on that, but mostly, it revolves around a predisposition to take risk and an ornery genetic background

    You only made one mistake. When he went for his belt, you should have crushed him. Physically as well as mentally.

    I have been in many situations in life in which maximum force with no time to get or use a weapon was possible, sometimes, outnumbered. If you are hesitating to decide what to do, it is already to late. If he had a weapon, you would have been screwed. The man was obviously deranged/mentally ill.

    Forget arming yourself with a gun, learn how to use every part of your body and object not nailed down as a weapon.
    I can't deliver UTOPIA, but I can create a HELL for you to LIVE in :)DoD:(

  15. #15
          Downtown's avatar
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    I'm guessing that Billy Blanks' Tae Bo doesn't count here?

  16. #16
    You only made one mistake. When he went for his belt, you should have crushed him. Physically as well as mentally.
    I have to admit I felt foolish for not beating the guy at that moment. I did everything but touch him I was right on top of him -at that point he cowered and I could see he was messing with his pants, I should have hit him at the least for practice.

    Forget arming yourself with a gun, learn how to use every part of your body and object not nailed down as a weapon.
    That's how I think. I do need some basic fighting skills.

  17. #17
    Cyburbian michaelskis's avatar
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    When I was living out east, I was walking back from getting a bite to eat, and someone tried to mug me. I guess the Irish side of me came out… It was only one of 5 times that I have gotten into a fight. He came up to me, and told me that if I did not give him my wallet, he would kick my a$$. I told him that I did not want any trouble, I just kept walking. He the grabbed at my pocket (I had my wallet in my coat instead). Something just kicked in and I threw an upper cut and hit him right square in the nose. He fell backwards (with a broken nose I am guessing) over his own feet. It did not last long, he was some young punk. (I think that most anyone could have taken him.) He took off running, and I walked away with my wallet and a sore fist.
    Not my monkey, not my circus. - Old Polish Proverb

  18. #18
    Cyburbian JNL's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Downtown
    I'm guessing that Billy Blanks' Tae Bo doesn't count here?
    I reckon it does! (although I never heard of Billy Blank) I did a bit of tae bo and it was good for teaching you how to put some power behind your punches and kicks, some different types of kicking and hitting, and also how to maintain your balance while punching and kicking - all useful to know! Just don't try to put it together in a fancy combo if you're trying to defend yourself!

  19. #19
    Cyburbian Seabishop's avatar
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    Related to the dream thread, has anyone had the dream where you need to defend yourself but can't move your arms or speak - that one sucks! (please DON'T analyse that one).

    Irish - I'm glad the guy came to his senses.

    A great Portland, OR experience was a crazed homeless guy in Pioneer Sq. yelling about "f&*^ing yuppies on their cell phones" - I was the "yuppy," but he got over it. I'm guessing he was a Cyburbianite.

    Edit: For the record, I was sitting by myself and quietly catching up with my wife who was thousands of miles away. I wasn't acting like a blowhard yapping about my stock portfolio or anything.
    Last edited by Seabishop; 15 Mar 2004 at 3:40 PM.

  20. #20
    Cyburbian Rumpy Tunanator's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Seabishop
    Related to the dream thread, has anyone had the dream where you need to defend yourself but can't move your arms or speak - that one sucks! (please DON'T analyse that one).
    I've had that one, the one where I couldn't run, and my favorite one, the falling in water and sinking to the bottom until I can't hold my breath anymore and awake from the dream.B-)

    BOT: Anybody ever just pick up whatevers nearby in a fight and use it to hit the person?
    A guy once told me, "Do not have any attachments, do not have anything in your life you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you spot the heat around the corner."


    Neil McCauley (Robert DeNiro): Heat 1995

  21. #21
    Cyburbian Dragon's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Rumpy Tunanator
    BOT: Anybody ever just pick up whatevers nearby in a fight and use it to hit the person?
    I didn't really pick anything up, but I bounced my brother's head off of a wall one time when we were fighting. It dazed him, I would call it a semi-knock out.

  22. #22
    Cyburbian biscuit's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Rumpy Tunanator
    BOT: Anybody ever just pick up whatevers nearby in a fight and use it to hit the person?
    No, but I've had my head knocked into a pay phone with a board four drunk jarheads picked up off the sidewalk. I still have a beautiful scar from that one. B-)

    I've had two years of tae-kwon-do training but have never used it because that I've never been in a real fight before. Well, excluding that one time in seventh grade when I pummeled this bigger kid who was always picking on me, but that really doesn't count. I've always been more of a lover and a talker than a fighter.

  23. #23
    Corn Burning Fool giff57's avatar
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    Once, years ago when we were hanging out at a friends gas station, this little guy jumped on my back and was punching my head. What he forgot , but I remembered was the corner of the counter was about ten feet behind us. I ran backwards as hard as I could, and he took the corner in the spine, didn't get off the floor for several minutes. Needless to say he never bothered me again.
    “As soon as public service ceases to be the chief business of the citizens, and they would rather serve with their money than with their persons, the State is not far from its fall”
    Jean-Jacques Rousseau

  24. #24
    Cyburbian MD Planner's avatar
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    My last "fight" was actually at the APA Conference in Boston in '98. I was sitting on a bench waiting for the "T" when these two long haired, scruffy, drinking out of a paper bag guys show up. All of a sudden the one guy starts talking about how somebody is going to get their ass beat. He then says to me "what do you think about that?" I go "why do you want to beat your buddy's ass?" At which point his buddy says "he's talking about you, not me." Well, the first guy walks over to where I'm sitting and stands in front of me. Then he smacks me on the side of my head. Then the other side. I'm all alone in a city I really don't know and this piece of of s&*t is smacking me around. So I did the only thing I could and in one motion stood up and punched him in the face as hard as I've ever hit anything. He goes flying back and I take off running. The station was an elevated one so I run through the turnstile and practically break my pelvis and then I almost fall down the steps down to the street. I look back and they're not chasing me so I slow down and head for my hotel and the bar. Scary but true.
    He's a planner, he's a dreamer, he's a sordid little schemer,
    Seems to think that money grows on trees . . .

  25. #25
    Cyburbian Seabishop's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by MD Planner
    My last "fight" was actually at the APA Conference in Boston in '98. I was sitting on a bench waiting for the "T" when these two long haired, scruffy, drinking out of a paper bag guys show up. ...
    My last almost-fight was at a T stop also (a drunk guy pushing his equally drunk and roudy girlfriend around). I guess the city needs even more gentrification.

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