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Thread: Zoning is too byzantine (boo-hoo!)

  1. #1

    Zoning is too byzantine (boo-hoo!)

    In response to: zoning is too byzantine (boo-hoo!) posted by sleepless in staten island on May 12, 1998 at 19:38:54:

    That's the developer's job, isn't it? If you can't stand the heat, why did you decide to enter this field? What peeves me more than developers working every angle to squeeze more density/$$ out of a project are fellow planners who, in an effort to weasel out of responsibility for being too short-sited or dimwitted to forsee their arguments, carp about "Adam Smith" types! God forbid that we should be inconvenienced by developers/builders/citizens operating in a capitalist system.

    That's planning in the United States! Shut up and do your job or move on.

  2. #2

    zoning is too byzantine (boo-hoo!)

    excuse me, but isn't carping the whole point of this bulletin board?
    what nerve: complaining about people complaining in a place dedicated to complaining! sounds like you've been listening to a bit too much rush limbaugh and/or howard stern. i detect some misplaced anger here.

  3. #3

    zoning is too byzantine (boo-hoo!)

    I think it's ok to complain about complainers. And it's ok to complain. Try moving to the small town of Carpinteria California where carping is in our roots. Both sides and others are worthy of more thought. Are developers and property owners members of the public we need to serve?

  4. #4

    zoning is too byzantine (boo-hoo!)

    "A developer does not just build a subdivision or an apartment: he/she is helping to bind or tear apart the intangible structure of a community with every strike of the hammer. Long after the developer has moved on, neighbors will experience the developer's legacy on a personal, daily basis."
    -from "Pocketbook Planning" by Sherilyn Wells

    When a developer or property owner proposes to bind together the "intangible structure of community" they should be served. When they propose to tear it apart through thoughtless, poorly designed and/or shoddily constructed development, sacrificing the common good for increased profit margins, no. As planners, our service should be to the larger community, both present and future. "Serving" such developers or property owners by assisting them in expediting and approving their projects is more like aiding and abetting. Are you seriously suggesting that planners should simply be expediters and should not exercise discretion or professional good judgement?

  5. #5

    zoning is too byzantine (boo-hoo!)

    Not expediters. But not roadblockers, either. Remember the law? Crappy developments are *generally* undertaken legally -- within the statutory, regulatory, and yes broader LEGAL planning context of the jurisdiction. If I don't have the tools to stop or change irresponsible proposals, and I and/or my predecessors were too gum-brained to anticipate and PLAN capital P-L-A-N (not REACT -- we aren't REACTORS) then NO BITCHIN' ALLOWED. I should LEARN from irresponsible developers and create the regulatory tools needed to block inappropriate development. WE, along with the politicians and citizens of the community, are to blame if communities are "torn apart." NOT DEVELOPERS EXCLUSIVELY. WE control the future of our quality of life. WE control the physical environment that comprises our community. WE are in charge of our destiny - NOT THE DEVELOPER. I don't like robber-baron developers and their creations any more than anyone else, but I hope I'm not wimp enough to place the blame anywhere besides where it belongs - in MY AND THE COMMUNITY'S lap.

  6. #6
    Apr 1997
    In a Van Down By the River

    zoning is too byzantine (boo-hoo!)

    How many zoning codes in this nation have not been "loopholed" by developers? Are you really surprised when they do so?

    Loopholing is the first chapter in "Development 101." It is the planner's responsibility to draft a code which is clear and concise. Developers aren't going to try and ferret out the intent of the ordinance - they are capitalists out to make a buck. If your code is full of glitches - fix it.

  7. #7

    zoning is too byzantine (boo-hoo!)

    You continue (obstinately, it seems) to miss my point. My original post had to do with the irony of developers who complain that my city's zoning resolution is complex, wordy and legalistic without understanding the part they play in making it so. Of course, I expect them to try to make every effort to use the zoning resolution to their advantage in the same way that I would (and do).

    Your insistance on framing the entire discussion in terms of who's to blame is simplistic and, once again, your choice of words ("gum-brained," "wimp") is needlessly provocative and argumentative.

  8. #8

    Go pick on somebody else

    One last note (really- this is getting tedious):
    take a look at the posts at the top about "Developers."
    If my post got your knickers in such a twist these
    "gum-brained" "wimps" should keep you busy for awhile.

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