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Poll results: Who do you choose?

Voters
29. You may not vote on this poll
  • Chicago

    1 3.45%
  • Montreal

    0 0%
  • New York

    8 27.59%
  • Los Angeles

    6 20.69%
  • Toronto

    7 24.14%
  • Boston

    1 3.45%
  • Vancouver

    2 6.90%
  • Dallas

    0 0%
  • Seattle

    0 0%
  • Philadelphia

    2 6.90%
  • Other

    2 6.90%
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Thread: Most Diverse City in North America

  1. #1
    Cyburbian
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    Most Diverse City in North America

    I dont have much to say really, what is your opinion on the topic?

  2. #2
    Cyburbian Hceux's avatar
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    I voted for T-dot. I might be biased as I haven't been to Chicago, LA, Dallas, and Seattle.

    Plus, what exactly do you, Copper, mean by 'most diverse'? Is your question in terms of ethnic background, economic diversity, cultural diversity, environmental diversity, or etc??

  3. #3
    Cyburbian
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    Here are my guesses for ethnic diversity, using my own made-up criteria.

    Criteria:
    1. Population >1 million
    2. White, Black, Hispanic, and Asian populations all >10%.
    - Note that Hispanic category is geographic and Hispanics can be of any race.
    - Figures from 2000 US census.

    Los Angeles pop. 3.7 million 46.9%, 11.2%, 46.5%, 10.0%

    Winner if census was done today is New York, 2000 figures: pop 8.0 million 44.7%, 26.6%, 27.0%, 9.8%


    Criteria:
    1. Population >100,000
    2. White, Black, Hispanic, and Asian populations all >15%.

    Jersey City pop. 240,000 34.0%, 28.3%, 28.3%, 16.2%


    Criteria:
    1. Population >25,000
    2. White, Black, Hispanic, and Asian populations all >20%.
    Carson, California pop. 90,000 25.7%, 25.4%, 34.9%, 22.3%

  4. #4
    Cyburbian jmello's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by jtmnkri
    Here are my guesses for ethnic diversity, using my own made-up criteria.
    1. Population >100,000
    2. White, Black, Hispanic, and Asian populations all >15%.
    Boston is a little low on the Asian front:
    White 54.5%
    Black or African American 25.3%
    American Indian and Alaska Native 0.4%
    Asian 7.5%
    Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander 0.1%
    Some other race (mostly Cape Verdean) 7.8%
    Hispanic or Latino (of any race) 14.4%

  5. #5
    Cyburbian donk's avatar
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    The following is adapted from from Stats Can


    A summary 43% of the population is a "visible minority" as defined by stats can


    Total population 2456805*
    Visible minority population* 1051125*
    ******
    Chinese* 259710*
    South Asian* 253920*
    Black* 204075*
    Filipino* 86460*
    Latin American* 54350*
    Southeast Asian* 33870*
    Arab* 22355*
    West Asian* 37205*
    Korean* 29755*
    Japanese* 11595*
    Aboriginal identity population* 11370*
    Visible minority n.i.e* 37985*
    Multiple visible minorities* 19855*
    ***

    Here is the link and sorry about the formatting.

    http://www12.statcan.ca/english/prof...&SEARCH=BEGINS

    If this topic is of interest to you and looking at social/racial enclaevs interests you look for teh CIP Journal from last summer with an article in it by Quadeer, a prof from Queens University in Kingston. He is looking at it and discusses cultural sensitivity in a planning framework.
    Too lazy to beat myself up for being to lazy to beat myself up for being too lazy to... well you get the point....

  6. #6
    Cyburbian abrowne's avatar
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    What about diverse forms of diversity, huh! What about that?!

  7. #7
    Cyburbian jordanb's avatar
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    What is this thread doing on Cyburbia?

    Keep it to the skyscraper forums please.

  8. #8
    Cyburbian abrowne's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by jordanb
    What is this thread doing on Cyburbia?

    Keep it to the skyscraper forums please.
    Good call. That, or Urban Canada forums. If I see one more Toronto vs. Blah thread during my periodic visits to Urban Canada forums I'm going to just light the GTA on fire and be done with it. It's especially hilarious (and maddening) because all the Toronto boosters live in the hellish outer ring suburbs of Brampton, Mississauga, Richmond Hill, Markham, and so forth. Heaven forbid their thoughts ever leave the GTA...

    And how on earth does one actually "rate" a skyline, for that matter? What the hell does that even mean? All my rage is just pouring out.

  9. #9
    Cyburbian
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    lol, I dont even go to Urban Canada anymore, I leave that on my signature out of pitty. I hope one day to go back and see the place active.....and properly run.

  10. #10
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    I'm almost certain it's NY.

    I read somewhere, can't remember, that Queens was the most diverse county in the world, and Brooklyn was second, and that Manhattan and the Bronx both made the US top 10.

  11. #11
    Cyburbian jread's avatar
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    I really think Houston should be on that list... especially over Dallas.
    "I don't suffer from insanity... I enjoy every single minute of it!"

  12. #12
    Unfrozen Caveman Planner mendelman's avatar
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    Chicago....but unfortunately we have a rather segregated diversity. Each in your own neighborhood, like many "most diverse" cities.
    I'm sorry. Is my bias showing?

    Let's not be didactic in this profession, because that is a path to disillusion and irrelevancy.

    Six seasons and a movie!

  13. #13
    Cyburbian jresta's avatar
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    2000/2004

    Philly is a very black and white city and is only diverse in parts. I'm only beginning to fathom the tradition of segregation that was rigidly enforced by the 19th Century european immigrants.

    My 95 year old neighbor, the daughter of italian immigrants, told me "don't go past 9th St. It's bad over there." My brother's neighbor, an old italian woman (who lives on 9th St.) asked "wareuh eww livuh" I told her "12th St." She said
    "uggghhh. twelve street. das baaaad. eww nottah scareduh?"

    45% of the population was white although the 2004 survey says that it has dropped to 42%.

    43.2% of the population was African American in 2000 which has climbed to 44.6% per the 2004 survey. Not because the population has grown but, according to the survey, 80,000 whites left the city compared to only 30,000 blacks.

    8.5% Latino - 9.9% Latino
    at this point the Latino population is probably still majority Puerto Rican (in the North and near Northeast) but by 2010 they'll probably be overtaken by the growing Mexican community in South Philly.

    and
    4.5% Asian - 5% Asian
    At first i found this hard to believe but then i remembered that much of the Korean community straddles the city line in both West Philly and around Fern Rock/Oak Lane so while the communities are large they're split between the city and the suburbs

    I'm also a little surprised/disappointed that there isn't an "African category". Philly has a sizeable population of North Africans in West Philly, East Africans in West Philly and West Africans in Southwest Philly
    Indeed you can usually tell when the concepts of democracy and citizenship are weakening. There is an increase in the role of charity and in the worship of volunteerism. These represent the élite citizen's imitation of noblesse oblige; that is, of pretending to be aristocrats or oligarchs, as opposed to being citizens.

  14. #14
    Cyburbian jmello's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by jresta
    4.5% Asian - 5% Asian
    At first i found this hard to believe but then i remembered that much of the Korean community straddles the city line in both West Philly and around Fern Rock/Oak Lane so while the communities are large they're split between the city and the suburbs
    Don't forget the Chinese and Vietnamese node around 9th & Washington and significant Asian student population in West Philly.

  15. #15
    Cyburbian jresta's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by jmello
    Don't forget the Chinese and Vietnamese node around 9th & Washington
    forget? I live there.

    I would give you the "asian student" thing but . . . suburban kids, regardless of race, with the kind of money that gets you into Penn or Drexel are about as diverse as the A&F catalogues they get their wardrobes from.

    You can get a much more authentic south asian experience at a strip mall in Cherry Hill or Bensalem.
    Indeed you can usually tell when the concepts of democracy and citizenship are weakening. There is an increase in the role of charity and in the worship of volunteerism. These represent the élite citizen's imitation of noblesse oblige; that is, of pretending to be aristocrats or oligarchs, as opposed to being citizens.

  16. #16
    Cyburbian jmello's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by jresta
    forget? I live there.
    Rereading this thread, I now think that I misunderstood your original point. At first I believed that you were questioning the Asian number as too high, which would be expected for Philly (a mostly black-white city). I now see that you were actually questioning it as too low, offering the city-suburban split as a cause.

  17. #17
    Cyburbian DetroitPlanner's avatar
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    Great great, now here's the rub, what are the most divese cities outside of the americas?

    Asia, Europe, and Africa are nowhere near as diverse as us 'new world areas' such as North America, South America, and Australia (with New Zeland).

    Is this because new worlders are a more tolerant group? Look at all of the tribal wars in Africa, Middle East, even in Ireland. The Amercias and Australia have always been brought into these fights from outside actions against them.

  18. #18
    Cyburbian abrowne's avatar
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    *bump

    Interesting thoughts in the above post. Any takers?

  19. #19
    Cyburbian
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    Actually, European cities are quite diverse these days. They are experiencing a great deal of immigration from Asia, both far-east and middle-east, as well as Africa. I don't have any satatistics, but in my recent trip to Paris, the "European Frencman" was definitely in the minority on the metro (subway).

    I tried to Google some statistics, but here is all I came up with. A study about the difficulties of colleccting such info., with a few statistics on foreign born/foreign citizenship http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/4/41/35082073.pdf

    In summary, countries highest to lowest percent foreign born (listed in this study):

    Luxembourg (about 33%)
    Asutralia (about 23%)
    Switzerland
    New Zealand (about 20%)
    Canada
    Austria (about 13%)
    Germany
    USA (about 12%)
    Sweden
    Belgium (about 11%)
    Ireland
    Greece (about 10%)
    Netherlands
    France
    United Kingdom (about 9%)
    Norway (about 8%)
    Denmark (about 7%)
    Portugal (about 6%)
    Spain
    Czech Republic (about 4%)
    Hungary (about 3%)
    Finland
    Slovak Republic
    Poland
    Turkey (about 2%)
    Mexico (about 1%)
    Japan (less than 1%)
    Korea

    Granted some of the European countries have a lot of immigration from other European countries, and where birthrates are low a little immigration has a big impact.

  20. #20
    Cyburbian Man With a Plan's avatar
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    Dc

    I would say DC/Arlington is the most diverse place I have ever been. Not only is it diverse, but that diversity in embraced and encouraged.

  21. #21
    Cyburbian jordanb's avatar
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    Doesn't Luxembourg have a much larger daytime population because people actually commute from other countries?

  22. #22

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    Quote Originally posted by Man With a Plan
    I would say DC/Arlington is the most diverse place I have ever been. Not only is it diverse, but that diversity in embraced and encouraged.
    Hmm...maybe compared to Boston But really DC is perhaps more than ever black-white, while Arlington is white-Hispanic. Arlington used to have a sizable SE Asian population, but the bulk of that population has moved to Fairfax and the outer suburbs. The most diverse areas of metro DC area are in certain parts of Fairfax (especially Bailey's Crossroads, Seven Corners, Annandale, increasingly Springfield, and the Rt. 50 corridor generally even now including western Fairfax)...Prince William and eastern Loudon Counties are also increasingly diverse (Latino and Asian, some African American in eastern PW). Montgomery County, Md is also very diverse, but I'm not as familiar with Maryland. So, DC metro as a whole is very diverse, but not the city proper -- certainly not anything even vaguely comparable to NYC with all of its distinct ethnic neighborhoods. One group that DC metro oddly lacks is Mexican -- its growing Hispanic population is largely Salvadoran, Peruvian, and Bolivian. For a while, I lived in Fairfax and would walk 4 minutes to the shopping center next to my apartment and would routinely hear 6-7 different languages (probably most commonly Spanish, Chinese/Mandarin, Korean, Arabic, Russian, Hindi, Vietnamese, and English, though I can't say that I could positively identify all of the languages that I would hear).

  23. #23
    Cyburbian jmello's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Kovanovich
    Hmm...maybe compared to Boston
    Did you see my post above? Boston is only 54% white, and with significant discrete physical communities of Irish, Italians, Chinese, Vietnamese, Brazilians, Cape Verdeans, Haitians, Russians, Jamaicans, Puerto Ricans, El Salvadorans, Armenians and Poles, it is much more ethnically diverse than most American cities. That's just within the city limits. There are also suburban communities of Portuguese, Greeks, Hasidic Jews, Indians, Cambodians and Laotians.
    Last edited by jmello; 15 Nov 2005 at 6:33 PM.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally posted by Kovanovich
    certainly not anything even vaguely comparable to NYC with all of its distinct ethnic neighborhoods.
    But is a collection of "distinct ethnic neighborhoods" diversity? Sounds more like segregation to me. Maybe DC's model of shifting and fluid enclaves (the growing Hispanic community joining African Americans in Columbia Heights) is perferable to New York's hardlined historical boundaries.

  25. #25

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    Quote Originally posted by passdoubt
    But is a collection of "distinct ethnic neighborhoods" diversity? Sounds more like segregation to me. Maybe DC's model of shifting and fluid enclaves (the growing Hispanic community joining African Americans in Columbia Heights) is perferable to New York's hardlined historical boundaries.

    There is something to be said for this...DC's city neighborhoods do lack a history of an ethnic identity (aside, again, from white-black). Contrast that with Brooklyn, or Philadelphia, or Boston. I think that immigration has worked well in the DC metro area. Of course, there are some problems (gangs, for instance), but on the whole the substantial immigrant population has integrated about as well as could be expected. It's rare to come across children of immigrant families (regardless of their ethnicity) who doesn't speak English, at least in my meandering experience. And the immigrant communities have brought some of the better, and cheaper, restaurants to the DC area A comparison with immigrants in northern New Jersey would be useful.

    I like Boston, and I am well aware of its large Portugese/Brazilian community as well as its Southeast Asian population and others. It is certainly more diverse with more recent immigrants than Cleveland, where I am from. But the feeling I get when I am there is that this is still a white city, with the Irish, Italian, and old New England Yankee populations still predominant. But anyway I was pretty much just kidding.

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