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Thread: SOTU Energy Promises

  1. #1
    Member Wulf9's avatar
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    SOTU Energy Promises

    I hope this does not devolve into the political arguments of other posts. Here is an article in today's paper.

    "One day after President Bush vowed to reduce America's dependence on Middle East oil by cutting imports from there 75% by 2025, his energy secretary and national economic advisor said Wednesday that the president did not mean it literally."

    The newspapers put energy conservation on the front page the day after SOTU. The retraction was buried.

  2. #2
    Cyburbian iamme's avatar
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    Could you provide a link?

    I would like to be surprised but I guess I don't know who would.

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    Chairman of the bored Maister's avatar
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    Not necessarily partisan commentary but I recall a good deal of political discussion back in the late 70's and early 80's (think Iranian hostage affair) where politicians thumped their chests about "reducing dependence on foreign oil" and so we went whole hog into extracting as much oil domestically as we could afford (not talking shale here) to. I never understood the wisdom of this argument as it did not address the issue of need/consumption, only the oil's source. In other words, it seemed to me that you'd want to use as much oil as you could from foreign sources while it's cheap and widely available and then as scarcity rose and the commodity becomes more precious, have more ample domestic reserves available.
    People will miss that it once meant something to be Southern or Midwestern. It doesn't mean much now, except for the climate. The question, “Where are you from?” doesn't lead to anything odd or interesting. They live somewhere near a Gap store, and what else do you need to know? - Garrison Keillor

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    Member Wulf9's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by iamme
    Could you provide a link?

    I would like to be surprised but I guess I don't know who would.
    This was a story in the Santa Rosa Press Democrat. I wanted to provide a link (because I didn't want to type the text in myself) but they didn't have it on their web page. Google didn't help either. That's my point. The energy promise was front page. "Bush to cut oil imports" or the like. The retraction is almost an un-covered story.

  5. #5
    moderator in moderation Suburb Repairman's avatar
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    There was a similar article in the San Antonio Express-News; I think it might be an AP story.

    "Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."

    - Herman Göring at the Nuremburg trials (thoughts on democracy)

  6. #6
    Cyburbian
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    Found it......

    What Bush meant, they said in a conference call with reporters, was that alternative fuels could displace an amount of oil imports equivalent to most of what America is expected to import from the Middle East in 2025. But America still would import oil from the Middle East because that is where the greatest oil supplies are.
    Huh??

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    Cyburbian imaplanner's avatar
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    This thread has the potential to be ugly. But it proves my point I made in the other thread about why I do not usually watch Bush speak- because everything coming out of that man's mouth is lip service. Its could easily just be "blah blah blah blah".

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    Gunfighter Mastiff's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by imaplanner
    This thread has the potential to be ugly. But it proves my point I made in the other thread about why I do not usually watch Bush speak- because everything coming out of that man's mouth is lip service. Its could easily just be "blah blah blah blah".
    C'mon now, that's not fair... Bush doesn't speak like that at all. He could never get four "blahs" out in a row.

    It would be, "Blah blah blah... you know, blah."



    (Just a good natured joke, Elephants...)
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    Cyburbian Michele Zone's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Mastiff
    C'mon now, that's not fair... Bush doesn't speak like that at all. He could never get four "blahs" out in a row.

    It would be, "Blah blah blah... you know, blah."



    (Just a good natured joke, Elephants...)
    I was expecting you to make a joke about him mispronunciating it somehow.

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    Cyburbian michaelskis's avatar
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    I am not sure how true that statement was. He might have been mis-quoted. Can anyone find a direct link to it?

    I ask because the press hearing text is here... and I can't find it. But then again, I might just be missing it. Press Room Link

    If what you say is true, (and someone can show me valid proof) I am going to be pi$$ed at W for saying that.
    Not my monkey, not my circus. - Old Polish Proverb

  11. #11
    Cyburbian imaplanner's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by michaelskis
    I

    If what you say is true, (and someone can show me valid proof) I am going to be pi$$ed at W for saying that.
    Good for you. What upsets me is the people who are so blinded that they will make excuses for and support that man regardless of anything that he does- like he can do no wrong. While still somewhat upsetting, I get less upset at the people who blindly hate the man regardless of what he does

    But what this episode, along with others show- is that the media has basically been beaten into a worthless pile of you know what. His energy "promise" about reducing mid-east oil dependence was all over the front oage of most newspapers and this story is so far pretty much buried.

    It also shows how unaccountable politicians in general have become about their words - and how the media and the public have allowed this to happen.

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    Member Wulf9's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by michaelskis
    I am not sure how true that statement was. He might have been mis-quoted. Can anyone find a direct link to it?
    If what you say is true, (and someone can show me valid proof) I am going to be pi$$ed at W for saying that.

    The basic premise is that we will have alternative energy sources equal to 90% of what we import from the middle east right now. That "will lead the country into a position of being able to reduce the amount of oil consumption in this country by 75 percent of what we expect to be importing from the Middle East in 2025."

    That changes the promise from "we will cut imports" to "we could if we want to." That also leaves the potential of "we won't."

    Bush believers will typically conclude that this next day change still leaves the option that the promise could be fulfilled. For unbelievers, there is the belief that the promise will not be fulfilled. You now get to decide if you are unhappy or not.

  13. #13
    Don't worry, they'll get around to it right after they finish planning the manned mission to Mars.

  14. #14
    Cyburbian
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    I have a different take on this. I think we all should take President Bush's inclusion of a broader energy discussion in his SOTU as a good thing. I mean it is just a SOTU, a broad policy and wish list statement really.

    His focus was not drilling in ANWAR right? He talked for the first time about the threat of reliance on foreign oil and the need for alternatives.

    We should be thirilled the topic of oil and energy are front page news. And its front page because the President most of the folks on this forum treat with an mazing amount of disresprect, put it there.

    Look at the glass half full for once.

    Where I probably break with everyone is that its not the GOVt job to develop those alternatives--its the private sector. And it also entails lifestyle changes that can and will only be iterative for Americans. People are buying Hybrids right?

    The CEO of GM said this in response to a question about why his company built the gas guzzeling Hummer: Because people want to buy them and we make money selling them.

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    Chairman of the bored Maister's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by imaplanner
    It also shows how unaccountable politicians in general have become about their words - and how the media and the public have allowed this to happen.
    There's more than a kernel of truth to this statement.
    People will miss that it once meant something to be Southern or Midwestern. It doesn't mean much now, except for the climate. The question, “Where are you from?” doesn't lead to anything odd or interesting. They live somewhere near a Gap store, and what else do you need to know? - Garrison Keillor

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    Member Wulf9's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by gkmo62u
    I have a different take on this. I think we all should take President Bush's inclusion of a broader energy discussion in his SOTU as a good thing. I mean it is just a SOTU, a broad policy and wish list statement really.

    His focus was not drilling in ANWAR right? He talked for the first time about the threat of reliance on foreign oil and the need for alternatives.

    We should be thirilled the topic of oil and energy are front page news. And its front page because the President most of the folks on this forum treat with an mazing amount of disresprect, put it there.

    Look at the glass half full for once.

    So, let's watch this one. The Clear Skies initiative resulted in reducing pollution standards. The Clean Water initiative resulted in reducing standards for arsenic in drinking water. Us half empty-folks suspect that the promise to reduce oil imports from the middle east will actually lead to increased middle east oil imports.

    You and I can both watch and see if there is truly an initiative to reduce middle east oil imports. I will be happy to bow to your wisdom if there is such a program. What concerns me is the propensity of the half-fullers to hang on to words, even when actions are not consistent with the words.

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