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Thread: [Article] Budget boost for GTA (Greater Toronto Area) transit

  1. #1
    maudit anglais
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    [Article] Budget boost for GTA (Greater Toronto Area) transit

    Toronto Star article about impending announcements from the Ontario government. Not only does it look like a $1.5 billion subway expansion is on the way, but also a regional transportation authority for the Greater Toronto Area. Let's hope this one works...Tranplanner wants a new job

    I'm not sold on the subway extension selected...as per usual around here, it's based more on political reasons than actual need.

  2. #2
    Quote Originally posted by Tranplanner
    Toronto Star article about impending announcements from the Ontario government. Not only does it look like a $1.5 billion subway expansion is on the way, but also a regional transportation authority for the Greater Toronto Area. Let's hope this one works...Tranplanner wants a new job

    I'm not sold on the subway extension selected...as per usual around here, it's based more on political reasons than actual need.
    I agree with your thoughts on the subway extension selection...but it isn't as much of a waste as the Sheppard line was, and the Spadina decision isn't as politically driven as the Sheppard one either. I think it'll help bring some jobs to that area of the city, one of the most desolate and drab, IMO.

    My dream world would be an Eglinton subway line. It is one of the few streets that goes across the entire Toronto area, and has both the density to sustain it, and the capacity for new density in many areas. Hopefully once the LRT is taken care of and updated, this GTTA can finally get us back to thinking about NEW lines, and not merely extensions or refurbishing of old ones.

    I also wonder if we'll see a reintroduction of zone fares.

  3. #3
    Cyburbian DetroitPlanner's avatar
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    Dear TTC please build more of those swell Bombardier Cars that go to the mall. And while your at it please make a few extra and share them with your friends down the 401 in Downtown Detroit.

    hmmm... "The TTC has many transit needs, including completing the Sheppard subway line to Scarborough Town Centre, replacing the Scarborough RT and creating more streetcar-only lanes throughout the city."

    Does this mean there will be extra cars available???
    We hope for better things; it will arise from the ashes - Fr Gabriel Richard 1805

  4. #4
    maudit anglais
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    Quote Originally posted by DetroitPlanner
    Dear TTC please build more of those swell Bombardier Cars that go to the mall. And while your at it please make a few extra and share them with your friends down the 401 in Downtown Detroit.

    hmmm... "The TTC has many transit needs, including completing the Sheppard subway line to Scarborough Town Centre, replacing the Scarborough RT and creating more streetcar-only lanes throughout the city."

    Does this mean there will be extra cars available???
    Funny, we were thinking about stealing Detroit's RT/people mover cars to replace/supplement the Scarborough RT cars, which are nearing the end of their service life. We figured no one would notice

    It would actually cost more to get Bombardier to re-start production of the older (Mark I) cars than it would be to buy brand new (Mark II) cars. Only problem is the Mark II cars won't fit on the Scarborough line...D'oh!

    I expect the existing Scarborough Mark I cars will be made surplus sometime around 2015.

  5. #5
    Cyburbian DetroitPlanner's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Tranplanner
    Funny, we were thinking about stealing Detroit's RT/people mover cars to replace/supplement the Scarborough RT cars, which are nearing the end of their service life. We figured no one would notice

    It would actually cost more to get Bombardier to re-start production of the older (Mark I) cars than it would be to buy brand new (Mark II) cars. Only problem is the Mark II cars won't fit on the Scarborough line...D'oh!

    I expect the existing Scarborough Mark I cars will be made surplus sometime around 2015.
    Our cars are getting old too, maybe we can bum rush Bombardier and hold em hostage till they make us new cars? Do you wrap your cars with advertising? Ever since that started here everyone wants one. I've been on the Cadillac Escalade Train and the 'New Downtown YMCA" trains just today. They make great billboards and generate operating revenue.
    We hope for better things; it will arise from the ashes - Fr Gabriel Richard 1805

  6. #6
    Cyburbian
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    Quote Originally posted by DetroitPlanner
    Do you wrap your cars with advertising?
    You tell me

    http://images.nycsubway.org//i36000/img_36910.jpg

    Haven't seen any on subway cars though.

    Anyway, all this transit spending is great. Now I know why i vote Liberal.

    Moderator note:
    (NHPlanner): Leeched image replaced with a URL.



    User suspended 24 hours for image leeching. The image's host site does not allow hotlinking under its terms of service: http://www.nycsubway.org/sitefaq.html
    Last edited by NHPlanner; 23 Mar 2006 at 2:16 PM.

  7. #7
    maudit anglais
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    Quote Originally posted by DetroitPlanner
    Our cars are getting old too, maybe we can bum rush Bombardier and hold em hostage till they make us new cars? Do you wrap your cars with advertising? Ever since that started here everyone wants one. I've been on the Cadillac Escalade Train and the 'New Downtown YMCA" trains just today. They make great billboards and generate operating revenue.
    We wrap streetcars (such as inCopper's example) and buses. We had a few subway wraps done a while back but now they just seem to "wrap" the doors. A few subway stations have been done up with a single advertiser - floors, pillars, etc. Never seen an RT car wrapped though.

    As far as I'm aware, the revenues generated by ad wrapping in Toronto aren't much.

  8. #8
    Cyburbian DetroitPlanner's avatar
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    here is a rare one. Subaru bought a wrap and got the local companies all in a fit about it.

    http://www.thepeoplemover.com/Exteri...raps.id.70.htm

    I like the streetcar wrap, very cool. It has much more appeal than a bus wrap those are getting tired. The site also posts our rates, which may not be much, but Detroit is not flush with money like Toronto .. we can use every penny we can get.
    We hope for better things; it will arise from the ashes - Fr Gabriel Richard 1805

  9. #9
    Cyburbian safege's avatar
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    The Las Vegas monorail has name brand stations, name brand wraps and interiors, and kiosks or vending machines. I think they have taken it about as far as it can go. The optimal advertising height doesn't hurt either.
    Psychotics are consistently inconsistent. The essence of sanity is to be inconsistently inconsistent.
    -Larry Wall

  10. #10
    Quote Originally posted by safege
    The Las Vegas monorail has name brand stations, name brand wraps and interiors, and kiosks or vending machines. I think they have taken it about as far as it can go. The optimal advertising height doesn't hurt either.

    How Much does Advertising subsidize Mass Transit? I think that if we're for sale the price should be high... and people should get a transparent benefits [aka: Fare Reduction].

    Good news to Toronto BTW. I visited there recently and was impressed with your above/underground system.

  11. #11
    Cyburbian andreplanner's avatar
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    Social planning at its finest...

    What about Eglinton West? What about Kingston Road? What about Extension of the RT and Sheppard Subway to meet?

    Speaking with a councillor about these priorities, they're all messed up. He believed St.Clair was a priority. Now we all know what a waste of money that ROW has become. Although it is a good idea, it shouldn't have been a PRIORITY.

    In my opinion, Scarborough should be a priority. If you want to stop isolating Scarborough, create some form of economic development, expand transit service. The RT is crumbling, crime is constantly rising, people must pay extra to use GO Transit to get to workplaces either downtown or in Durham Region.

    Eglinton West line is another priority. This was killed by the previous provincial government and should have taken precedence over Sheppard. Lots of opportunity there. Has anyone ever travelled along Eglinton from Yonge to Keele? It's bad.

    Sometimes I wonder why would I ever want to live in a city that's so backwards in their thinking.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally posted by andreplanner
    What about Eglinton West? What about Kingston Road? What about Extension of the RT and Sheppard Subway to meet?

    Speaking with a councillor about these priorities, they're all messed up. He believed St.Clair was a priority. Now we all know what a waste of money that ROW has become. Although it is a good idea, it shouldn't have been a PRIORITY.

    In my opinion, Scarborough should be a priority. If you want to stop isolating Scarborough, create some form of economic development, expand transit service. The RT is crumbling, crime is constantly rising, people must pay extra to use GO Transit to get to workplaces either downtown or in Durham Region.

    Eglinton West line is another priority. This was killed by the previous provincial government and should have taken precedence over Sheppard. Lots of opportunity there. Has anyone ever travelled along Eglinton from Yonge to Keele? It's bad.

    Sometimes I wonder why would I ever want to live in a city that's so backwards in their thinking.
    Yeah, Eglinton west of the Eglinton West subway station is a little scary. I think if they could find a way to put some rapid transit, it would improve quite a bit. I even like the idea of an Eglinton subway line someday. It'd be expensive, but behind Yonge St, the 401 and Bloor St, Eglinton is easily the most important road in the city, and yet has plenty of gaps and room to grow. Every other major east-west street south of it has either a Streetcar or Subway servicing it...and yet we jumped up to Sheppard, leaving no East-West rapid transit between from St. Clair to the 401. Doesn't make sense to me.

  13. #13
    Cyburbian
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    To me the question is, instead of taking the subway up to an as-of-yet-non-existent Vaughan "downtown" centre, why not take it up to York University and use the rest of the money to link Downsview station across Sheppard to the rest of the Sheppard subway line and then *gasp* perhaps extend the Sheppard 'stubway' out to Scarborough to replace the old RT? i know it would probably be more than the budget could afford at this point, but it could be done in strategic phases and then redeem the Sheppard line which is otherwise just a huge loss... no?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally posted by Suzan
    To me the question is, instead of taking the subway up to an as-of-yet-non-existent Vaughan "downtown" centre, why not take it up to York University and use the rest of the money to link Downsview station across Sheppard to the rest of the Sheppard subway line and then *gasp* perhaps extend the Sheppard 'stubway' out to Scarborough to replace the old RT? i know it would probably be more than the budget could afford at this point, but it could be done in strategic phases and then redeem the Sheppard line which is otherwise just a huge loss... no?
    The EA for what you proposed hasn't been completed and the budget included money for an EA for the best option for replacing the SRT. The Vaughan subway extension EA isn't completed but it was already underway, and when it's finished, it will still be years until construction actually gets underway.

    I think the big push for this was to get more VIVA riders/Yorkers using the Spadina line instead of the already overpacked Yonge line. Extening the Sheppard line is always nice but right now Yonge can't handle more pressure because it's already seeing packed cars now.Really, the best option for replacing the SRT would be extending the B-D line the route it already goes and putting elevated sections everywhere it can. Realistically, it'd probably be cheaper than boreing the entire Sheppard line across.

    Really though, the best option would be the one proposed by the Weston Anti-Blue22 Group. It connects Union to Pearson, puts reliable transit in an underserved area, and the ROW is already there for almost all of it so the costs would be kept down.

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