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Thread: Republicans eat their own

  1. #1
    Cyburbian hilldweller's avatar
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    Republicans eat their own

    As the bloody quagmire in Iraq slogs along a number of GOP members of congress have finally decided to buck Bush's "war and obedience" agenda. Sen. John Warner has proposed a resolution against the White House's troop surge plan which will likely draw a number of GOP supporters. This has prompted a predictable response for the GOP faithful, who have attacked these rogue colleagues for "emboldening the terrorists", or something along this line that basically follows the script of the White House spin machine.
    The inevitable failure in Iraq threatens to tear the Republican party apart, and will have a huge impact on its 2008 election prospects. As more and more Republicans try to save their own hides politically and abandon Bush's sinking ship, what will be the future of the Republican party? Will the dead-enders in the GOP be able to survive?

  2. #2
    Cyburbian Greenescapist's avatar
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    I'm sure the Republicans will all come behind their 2008 nominee. The GOP has much better discipline as a party then do the Democrats. I think once McCain or whomever is selected, they will try to put their differences behind them to try to elect him. I wish it were otherwise, but who knows...

  3. #3
    Cyburbian gicarto's avatar
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    I would like to see the republicans bounce back in 08 but I think the party will hold out until 2012 after Hillary has proven to be a dismal failure. The Republicans under Bush have become to liberal and big government. My hope is that we see a return of the conservatives (excluding the reactionaries) in 2012 with a message of individualism and enterprise.

    The Republicans' biggest problem right now are RINOs (republicans in name only or liberal republicans) and they alienated the conservatives in the 06 election and they did not vote. Conservatives do not stand for corruption in government and the 06 election was a message to the republicans that conservatives will not stand for it.
    Trying to get my grubby hands on as much stimulus money as I can.:D

  4. #4
    Cyburbian otterpop's avatar
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    I don't think the Republican Party will suffer much from Bush's fiascos. I think most Americans, including a lot of Republicans, realize an incompetent and arrogant man is President. If the party finds a good candidate for the 2008 election, they have a good shot.

    My hope is both parties come up with good candidates for the upcoming national elections.
    "I am very good at reading women, but I get into trouble for using the Braille method."

    ~ Otterpop ~

  5. #5
    Cyburbian gicarto's avatar
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    I am supporting Mitt Romney
    Trying to get my grubby hands on as much stimulus money as I can.:D

  6. #6
    Quote Originally posted by gicarto View post

    <snip>

    The Republicans' biggest problem right now are RINOs (republicans in name only or liberal republicans) and they alienated the conservatives in the 06 election and they did not vote. Conservatives do not stand for corruption in government and the 06 election was a message to the republicans that conservatives will not stand for it.
    Um, as a member of the Rockefeller/Roosevelt wing of the Grand Old Party, I take exception to the idea that we alienated the radical right and kept them home in '06. Indeed, I see it as exactly opposite -- the conservative wing monopolized social issues with a vengeance and thus drove us to vote Democratic, or not to vote at all.

    To imply that the left wing of the GOP somehow endorses corruption is spurious at best.

    I think there is a very deep schism within the Republican Party and it seems more likely to me that the party will split, probably later than sooner, however if they can field a centrist candidate in '08. That said, McCain's sharp right turn means he isn't the next "uniter", IMO.
    No longer for better. No longer for worse. And certainly not for lunch.

  7. #7
    Cyburbian gicarto's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Gedunker View post
    Um, as a member of the Rockefeller/Roosevelt wing of the Grand Old Party, I take exception to the idea that we alienated the radical right and kept them home in '06. Indeed, I see it as exactly opposite -- the conservative wing monopolized social issues with a vengeance and thus drove us to vote Democratic, or not to vote at all.

    To imply that the left wing of the GOP somehow endorses corruption is spurious at best.

    I think there is a very deep schism within the Republican Party and it seems more likely to me that the party will split, probably later than sooner, however if they can field a centrist candidate in '08. That said, McCain's sharp right turn means he isn't the next "uniter", IMO.
    I apologize
    It was not my goal to imply that the liberal republicans were the corrupt ones. The point I was trying to make is that conservative voters were angry with the corruption with Jack Abramoff and lost hope in the 94 revolution.

    I agree that the religious right (who I don't see as conservative) also helped ruin it for us in 06.
    Trying to get my grubby hands on as much stimulus money as I can.:D

  8. #8
    Cyburbian michaelskis's avatar
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    I will be pouring fresh animal blood into the ring as Hillary works to rip Obama’s head off and Al Gore chews is own arm off.

    The more that I look at the candidates; the more I think Rudy is my guy. He has a colorful past, but he will tell the joint chiefs to F off when they as for funding for something stupid.
    The most foolish thing one can do this fall is to vote for Clinton or Trump. Wake up, get out of the matrix, and send a message to the political establishment that you won't play their game.

  9. #9
    Cyburbian Zoning Goddess's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by michaelskis View post
    The more that I look at the candidates; the more I think Rudy is my guy.
    Too bad he has that stinking Yankee accent that makes Southerners cringe. Sorry, but it really is a political reality. hehehehe....

  10. #10
    With the deficit death spiral the Republicans have plunged the government into, a better question to ask would be if the Republican party will outlive the federal government.

  11. #11
    Cyburbian Budgie's avatar
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    It seems as if there are self proclaimed Republicans posting to this thread. So where is EG? Perhaps he isn't a "token" after all.

    As for me... I have better things to do than ponder petty CYA's in Washington. How could anyone not have seen in 2000 that Bush was incompetent? So now if you have to play Chicken Little to survive as an incumbent Republican, so be it. If you'd had the guts to say something 7 years ago, maybe you wouldn't have you tail between your legs now. Why aren't you guys "staying the course"? Oh that's right... only the Captain goes down with the ship.
    "And all this terrible change had come about because he had ceased to believe himself and had taken to believing others. " - Leo Tolstoy

  12. #12
    Cyburbian Emeritus Chet's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by michaelskis View post
    The more that I look at the candidates; the more I think Rudy is my guy.
    A divorced New Yorker has no chance of carrying the south. He might as well be gay too. Good luck with that.

  13. #13
    Cyburbian Brocktoon's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by gicarto View post
    I apologize
    It was not my goal to imply that the liberal republicans were the corrupt ones. The point I was trying to make is that conservative voters were angry with the corruption with Jack Abramoff and lost hope in the 94 revolution.

    I agree that the religious right (who I don't see as conservative) also helped ruin it for us in 06.
    You consider Randy Cunningham, Tom Delay, Bob Ney, JD Hayworth, all to be liberal? The liberals of the party were not the problem, they were not in leadership of the party but it was the hubris that tends to infect the majority party coupled with an unpopular president.

    The liberals have been dieing in the GOP for 20 years. The past 2 elections have just about killed them off. I think the lack of diversity on the issues will hurt the party. The Democrats benefited from widening their party, you cannot be the majority party by being the small tent party. If the GOP keeps alienating the center of the political spectrum then they can look forward to being in the minority for many years. Rove can talk about how his base beat Kerry but in reality he won the center of the electorate which put him over the top.

    Quote Originally posted by michaelskis View post
    I will be pouring fresh animal blood into the ring as Hillary works to rip Obama’s head off and Al Gore chews is own arm off.

    The more that I look at the candidates; the more I think Rudy is my guy. He has a colorful past, but he will tell the joint chiefs to F off when they as for funding for something stupid.
    The Clintons love to get in the mud. I think a lack of civility will be the only common theme in both primaries.

    M'skis backing the pro choice, pro gay, anti gun, fiscal moderate of Rudy. I don't think his views represent the Republican party as a whole but if the GOP cares more about winning then Rudy is their man.
    Last edited by NHPlanner; 05 Feb 2007 at 8:53 AM. Reason: double reply
    "You merely adopted the dark. I was born in it,..." -Bane

  14. #14
    Cyburbian michaelskis's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Brocktoon View post
    The Clintons love to get in the mud. I think a lack of civility will be the only common theme in both primaries.

    M'skis backing the pro choice, pro gay, anti gun, fiscal moderate of Rudy. I don't think his views represent the Republican party as a whole but if the GOP cares more about winning then Rudy is their man.
    I agree... but I don't think he is right wing enough to get the nomination. I am not sure about McCain because he does not seem stable in his direction.
    The most foolish thing one can do this fall is to vote for Clinton or Trump. Wake up, get out of the matrix, and send a message to the political establishment that you won't play their game.

  15. #15
    Cyburbian Luca's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by jaws View post
    With the deficit death spiral the Republicans have plunged the government into, a better question to ask would be if the Republican party will outlive the federal government.



    The US federal deficit is a smaller percentage of GDP than nominal GDP growth... debt/GDP is essentially stable. How is that a "death spiral". Really, Jaws.


    On the GOP: People keep decrying the loss of influence of the 2Rockerfeller" republcians but ti seems to em that their natural voter base (white middle class benign elitists) has shrunk to the point of irrelevance.Bush Sr., who epitomized that class was endlessly ridiculed anf politcally hampred due to it. The hard core GOP voter base (albeit a minority of its voters) for the current GOP seems to me like a grab bag of hyper-nationalists/neofascists like Rove, bible-belt inbreds and, more typcially, ecology deniers/gated community supporters. Lacking a recent example of total Democratic economic mismanagement (US had it reasonably good under Clinton) or the bogey-man of being a 'war president', I don't see how they cana ttract enough centrists without alienating the hard core types.

    On McCain: how many primaries candidates take on unyielding stances on anything??? And succeed??? Primaries are the epitome of personality/"character" politics and slick campaigning.
    Life and death of great pattern languages

  16. #16
    Quote Originally posted by Luca View post


    The US federal deficit is a smaller percentage of GDP than nominal GDP growth... debt/GDP is essentially stable. How is that a "death spiral". Really, Jaws.
    Don't listen to me, listen to the government's own accountants.

  17. #17
    Cyburbian Brocktoon's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by michaelskis View post
    I agree... but I don't think he is right wing enough to get the nomination. I am not sure about McCain because he does not seem stable in his direction.
    Giuliani also has a habit of sticking his foot in his mouth. His attempt to sue gun manufactures in 1999/2000 will not go over well in NH or SC.

    I think what will hurt McCain is many people are in love with the idea of him but do not understand his views and beliefs. The same thing with Giuliani. Arizona Republicanism has an element of the Libertarian, "live and let live" attitude especially towards personal matters. This will hurt him with the religious right but he is a true fiscal conservative and a hawk will help him with the rank and file of the party.

    Republicans also tend to anoint there presidential contenders much more so than the Democrats. McCain has waited his turn and has been a good foot soldier (at least for the past 3 years) and the Republican establishment will line up behind him. He has the staff, the funding and the name recognition.
    "You merely adopted the dark. I was born in it,..." -Bane

  18. #18
    Cyburbian Plan-it's avatar
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    As a true independent, the only Republican out of this field that I would consider voting for is Guliani. The middle ground inddependents in the electorate are who decide elections. The Republicans may want to consider that fact in picking their candidate.
    Satellite City Enabler

  19. #19
    Quote Originally posted by Plan-it View post
    As a true independent, the only Republican out of this field that I would consider voting for is Guliani. The middle ground inddependents in the electorate are who decide elections. The Republicans may want to consider that fact in picking their candidate.
    Independants help in winning an election but if you don't have your base supporting your candidate, you're sunk. The reason for this is because you can't fundraise well and get out the vote without the diehard party members. That means the little old ladies that will man the phones and stuff envelopes for hours on end. Those people tend to be on the extreme ends of both parties.

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