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Thread: The unemployed planner support thread

  1. #351
    Cyburbian Emeritus Chet's avatar
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    damn, Mendelman, that sucks.

    On a Chet bright side, the place I interviewed with last Friday called my references yesterday, and my 2nd interview isn't till Monday. They also told one of my references that the candidate pool was small.

  2. #352
    Cyburbian Joe Iliff's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by mendelman View post
    Well, as of yesterday morning, I have joined the ranks of laid off planners.

    Now, begins the job search.
    Sorry to hear that, mendel.
    JOE ILIFF
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    "Rarely do we find men who willingly engage in hard, solid thinking. There is an almost universal quest for easy answers and half-baked solutions. Nothing pains some people more than having to think."
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  3. #353
    Cyburbian rcgplanner's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by mendelman View post
    Well, as of yesterday morning, I have joined the ranks of laid off planners.

    Now, begins the job search.
    I hate to hear about another planner joining the ranks of the unemployed. My thoughts go out to you and your family. Hopefully it will be a fruitful and short job search!

  4. #354
    Cyburbian boiker's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by mendelman View post
    Well, as of yesterday morning, I have joined the ranks of laid off planners.

    Now, begins the job search.
    Dammit.. that sucks. I wish you the best of luck and keep in touch with me. Give me a call sometime, we need to talk.
    Dude, I'm cheesing so hard right now.

  5. #355
    Cyburbian Plus dandy_warhol's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by mendelman View post
    Well, as of yesterday morning, I have joined the ranks of laid off planners.

    Now, begins the job search.
    Holy Sh!t! I'm so sorry to hear that. What happened?
    In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends. -Martin Luther King Jr.

  6. #356
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    Is there a forum for planners that finished their masters degrees during the credit crunch and have not had to opportunity to have had that first job from which to get laid off?
    I look at the job postings weekly, if not daily, and find that most new employment opportunities require some sort of experience (3-10 years) to be considered for an interview. And even if the posting doesn't specifically say years of experience is a requirement, there are hundreds of people applying for every posting from the "entry level" positions on up to the Director of Planning jobs with many more years of experience than I can claim to have.
    These are the people getting interviewed, not the newly graduated. I just fear that once the dust settles and people start hiring again in greater numbers, those with 3-10 years experience and those fresh out of school will be the ones getting hired and those of us that finished school in 2008-2009 with no hope of getting that first job will remain out of the loop.

    Am I the only one that feels this way? Am I being too negative?

  7. #357
    Cyburbian Plus Salmissra's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by mendelman View post
    Well, as of yesterday morning, I have joined the ranks of laid off planners.

    Now, begins the job search.
    OUCH! I'm sorry to hear this. Was there any warning?
    "We do not need any other Tutankhamun's tomb with all its treasures. We need context. We need understanding. We need knowledge of historical events to tie them together. We don't know much. Of course we know a lot, but it is context that's missing, not treasures." - Werner Herzog, in Archaeology, March/April 2011

  8. #358
    Cyburbian Tide's avatar
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    Sorry to hear this man. I feel for you having been without work 14 of the last 16 months. If you need to talk or want any advice or another eye on your resume or cover letter let me know, I've learned a lot over the last year and a half.
    @GigCityPlanner

  9. #359
    moderator in moderation Suburb Repairman's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by mendelman View post
    Well, as of yesterday morning, I have joined the ranks of laid off planners.

    Now, begins the job search.
    Holy crap man, that is awful! You've got some mad skills though, so hopefully it'll be a short-term situation.

    "Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."

    - Herman Göring at the Nuremburg trials (thoughts on democracy)

  10. #360
    Cyburbia Administrator Dan's avatar
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    Damnit! I just realized that in one of the three job applications I sent out on Thursday, I has a misspelled word in my cover letter: "multidisciplinary", Spelled it "multidiciplinary", and Microsoft Word didn't underline it. I'm doomed.
    Growth for growth's sake is the ideology of the cancer cell. -- Edward Abbey

  11. #361
    Cyburbian Emeritus Chet's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Dan View post
    I'm doomed.
    Maybe not. In this economy, they are likely to be swamped with applicants.

    I recall when I was a PD and got 80 resumes for a GIS coordinator position, I tossed the cover letters and went right to the resumes. (And all the resumes from India went in the 'NO' pile before the 80 count).

  12. #362
    Cyburbia Administrator Dan's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Quasar2010 View post
    Is there a forum for planners that finished their masters degrees during the credit crunch and have not had to opportunity to have had that first job from which to get laid off?
    I look at the job postings weekly, if not daily, and find that most new employment opportunities require some sort of experience (3-10 years) to be considered for an interview. And even if the posting doesn't specifically say years of experience is a requirement, there are hundreds of people applying for every posting from the "entry level" positions on up to the Director of Planning jobs with many more years of experience than I can claim to have.
    These are the people getting interviewed, not the newly graduated. I just fear that once the dust settles and people start hiring again in greater numbers, those with 3-10 years experience and those fresh out of school will be the ones getting hired and those of us that finished school in 2008-2009 with no hope of getting that first job will remain out of the loop.

    Am I the only one that feels this way? Am I being too negative?
    You can start a new thread in this subforum. I wonder if the definition of "unemployed" extends to those newly minted MUPs and MURPs who can't find jobs.

    Here's the thing:

    * The vacancies normally created by the shuffle resulting from retiring planners are fewer, because older planners are staying at their jobs longer to recover losses from the stock market crash (I know I won't be retiring at 65), and budget cuts and hiring freezes are keeping vacancies unfilled.

    * Lots of planners are getting laid off. I don't know if many of them are seeking out lower level positions, though, with employers still wary of hiring those who are overqualified; a principal-level planner will likely be looking to leave an associate/II-level position as soon as they're hired.

    * New no-experience-necessary planning jobs are usually created during growth periods, when a community is flush with cash and development, can afford to implement departmental staffing plans, and the planners at the agency are overworked and begging to take on a noob for basic but time-consuming current planning duties (e.g. sign permits, simple subdivisions and boundary line adjustments) to help take the load off.

    If I were in my early-to-mid 20s, just out of grad school, in a job market where new positions are nonexistent, and had no other obligations, I'd be looking at the Peace Corps. If I was still in grad school, I'd be looking at a transportation specialization.
    Growth for growth's sake is the ideology of the cancer cell. -- Edward Abbey

  13. #363
    Cyburbian Tide's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Dan View post
    Damnit! I just realized that in one of the three job applications I sent out on Thursday, I has a misspelled word in my cover letter: "multidisciplinary", Spelled it "multidiciplinary", and Microsoft Word didn't underline it. I'm doomed.
    Depending on how quickly they read through it they may not even pick up on it. Don't sweat it too much.
    @GigCityPlanner

  14. #364
    NIMBY asshatterer Plus Richmond Jake's avatar
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    Given the economic conditions, me thinks two posters here should have kept their jobs in Texas.

    But I could be wrong.

  15. #365
    Cyburbian The District's avatar
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    I wonder if the definition of "unemployed" extends to those newly minted MUPs and MURPs who can't find jobs.
    No, it doesn't. That's the problem with simply relying on unemployment numbers to look at the absorption of graduates--graduates not able to find work are NOT counted in those ranks. There are other figures calculated by the government that accounts for this, but simple unemployment is not one of them.

  16. #366
    Unfrozen Caveman Planner mendelman's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by RichmondJake View post
    Given the economic conditions, me thinks two posters here should have kept their jobs in Texas.

    But I could be wrong.
    Watch it man. No need for the tone (and it's there).
    I'm sorry. Is my bias showing?

    Let's not be didactic in this profession, because that is a path to disillusion and irrelevancy.

    Six seasons and a movie!

  17. #367
    Cyburbia Administrator Dan's avatar
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    It's already bad enough that one has to sift through hundreds of manufacturing process planner-type jobs on online job listing and newspaper classified ad sites. Now the APA is listing them, too.

    Also, if the economy in California is so dismal, why are there still so many job listings for planning jobs in the state compared to other parts of the country?
    Growth for growth's sake is the ideology of the cancer cell. -- Edward Abbey

  18. #368
    Cyburbian Veloise's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Dan View post
    It's already bad enough that one has to sift through hundreds of manufacturing process planner-type jobs on online job listing and newspaper classified ad sites. Now the APA is listing them, too. ...
    APA's listings have been broken for several weeks now. On my occasional visits, I get a list of conferences and events held by various consulting firms.

  19. #369
    Cyburbian Raf's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Dan View post
    Also, if the economy in California is so dismal, why are there still so many job listings for planning jobs in the state compared to other parts of the country?
    Retirements. Government Agencies have to publicly post a job opening. period.

    2nd: Environmental/Transportation planning openings are and have been fewer, but still going.

    3rd: The economy is bad, but we are still growing as a state. They just have a larger job pool to choose from now.

    Even though there are job postings. Competition is fierce, but things are looking up
    Men do dumb $hit... it is what they do to correct the problem that counts.

  20. #370
    OH....IO Hink's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Dan View post
    It's already bad enough that one has to sift through hundreds of manufacturing process planner-type jobs on online job listing and newspaper classified ad sites. Now the APA is listing them, too.
    That is poor management by APA. They should really be watching the jobs and making sure they are relevant to our profession. They work very hard to make sure the AICP is getting recognized, then let a "planning" job on their website, which doesn't involve anything remotely to do with the urban planning profession??
    A common mistake people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools. -Douglas Adams

  21. #371
    Cyburbia Administrator Dan's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Hink_Planner View post
    That is poor management by APA. They should really be watching the jobs and making sure they are relevant to our profession. They work very hard to make sure the AICP is getting recognized, then let a "planning" job on their website, which doesn't involve anything remotely to do with the urban planning profession??
    Not only that, but they're also following the lead of LEED, and adding certification specialties this year or next.

    Inn the meantime, I guess this means we shouldn't be surprised to see ads for wedding planners and financial planners on the APA site. (Ads for financial planning and wedding planning-related services occasionally appear in the Google Adsense banners on Cyburbia thanks to the prevalence of the words "planner" and "planning" on most pages here.)

    Tide's blog offers some good advice for weeding out real planning ads on job listing sites; mainly, include some planning jargon or "AICP" in the search. I hope it doesn't come down to doing that on the APA site, too.
    Growth for growth's sake is the ideology of the cancer cell. -- Edward Abbey

  22. #372
    I too, have noticed more and more non-city planning-related jobs being posted on "our" boards.

    E.g.: The following was posted on the Central Coast APA job list:

    -------

    Associate Professional, Environmental Monitoring

    Location: California
    Company: Allergan Inc.
    Posted: January 15, 2010

    Allergan is a global, technology-driven multi-specialty health care company pursuing therapeutic advances to help patients live life to their fullest potential. In making this commitment, we work to develop an unparalleled level of insight into patients' wants and needs - and into the priorities and concerns of the medical specialists who treat them.
    [...]
    The position is accountable for: air and surface monitoring of aseptic filling rooms and lines in the PSO Manufacturing facility; planning, performing, interpreting and reporting results of microbiological testing which ensure the safety and purity of finished products prior to their release for clinical studies; designing, performing, interpreting, and reporting results of investigational testing which provide manufacturing groups information for procedure improvement or corrective action.


    ------

    A glance through the description would seem to preclude the applicability of this position for city planners. I mean, how many APA-wonks have experience in "surface monitoring of aseptic filling rooms"? Is a "WTF" inappropriate here?

  23. #373
    Cyburbian Tobinn's avatar
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    Job Websites

    I hope these sites are of some use. I've been using these in anticipation of some sort of closure to my "slow firing". I hope some of them are useful to you.

    To everyone looking for work, I'm rooting for you, really.

    Just remember, there's always a light at the end of the tunnel, however that light may be New Jersey (it's OK, I'm from NJ, I can say that).

    http://www.jobbankinfo.org/
    This website was discontinued July 1, 2007 BUT there is a map where you can click on a State and get directed to other job search websites.

    http://www.aejob.com/
    Easy to use. Quick resume and job search agent setup. Specific to Planners, Architects, Engineers and similar professions
    https://www.cwds.state.pa.us/cwdsonl...G0z8p8kMuVkIjz
    State of PA job site

    https://joblink.delaware.gov/ada/
    Sate of DE job site

    https://www.employflorida.com/
    State of Florida job site. Government sponsored. Extensive entry options. Takes a while to fill everything out but it's easy to use.

    https://www.federaljobsearch.com/login.asp?cid=0&tid=
    This site really wants you upgrade to the premium service for a fee but it's worth looking at from time to time.

    http://www.geturbanplanningjobs.com/
    Basic search engine - includes planning, engineering, transportation planning, etc.

    http://www.govtjobs.com/plan/index.html
    You can subscribe through your email - this is just for government jobs.

    http://www.indeed.com/
    Just a basic job search - no resume posting or job agent

    http://www.jobbankusa.com/
    Fair to middling job site

    http://www.job-hunt.org/
    This is sort of a clearing house for job hunting articles, advice and search sites

    http://www.careersingovernment.com
    must be renewed every 60 days

    http://www.jobster.com
    No comment on this one - I just found it the other day

    http://www.jobtrak.com/
    Also called MonsterTrak

    http://www.nationjob.com
    Average at best

    http://www.jobcentral.org/nj/account.asp
    New Jersey's Labor Exchange

    http://www.americasjobexchange.com/Login
    New York job site

    http://www.nj.com/jobs/
    New Jersey job site

    http://lwd.dol.state.nj.us/labor/wnj...djobindex.html
    Very tricky to enter data in - sometimes you can copy and paste in sometimes you can't - no rhyme or reason.

    http://www.razume.com/
    No comments for this one either - just found it.

    http://www.sequencestaffing.com/comp...er/Itemid,290/
    Again, no comments, just found it although I don't hold high expectations for this site.
    http://www.statelocalgov.net/
    Not a job site but rather a link site to municipalities throughout the US

    http://www.tristatejobs.com/
    I just get error messages but maybe someone else will have better luck.
    At times like this, you have to ask yourself, "WWJDD?"
    (What Would Jimmy Durante Do?)

  24. #374
    NIMBY asshatterer Plus Richmond Jake's avatar
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    This isn't support...

    ...and it's gonna break some of ya'lls water.

    http://www.santacruzsentinel.com/ci_...5?source=email

    The ironic point: most of us on this board are more qualified for the job than her.
    Trust me.

  25. #375
    Cyburbian stroskey's avatar
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    It's not what you know, it's who you know.

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