Urban planning community

+ Reply to thread
Results 1 to 17 of 17

Thread: Destination retail development examples

  1. #1
    Member
    Registered
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    2

    Destination retail development examples

    I want to develop a list (say 5 to 10) of large (100 to 1,000 acre) “destination retail” developments that employ the best current design practices, preferably developed in the last 5 years. Best current design practices to include such items as creative placemaking, good traffic and pedestrian management with focus on good walkability. The traffic management component is important due to the large number of people involved, so good circulation of vehicles in and out of the development is important. Transit oriented design is not a primary criteria, although provisions for future addition would be a nice side feature.

    The projects can have a mix of regional big box (Bass Pro Shop, Ikea, etc.) as well as a towncenter concept to employ well designed retail with other uses (residential, office, lodging, theatres).

    Would also like some good suggestions for “placemaking” features for such a development that have been successful (i.e., ice skating rinks, public realm with open space for events, music, etc.)

    Entertainment ideas that would provide a regional draw are also desired such as water parks, large scale soccer parks, minor league sports, aquariums.

    One example of the type and scale of development is the Legends at Village West in Kansas City. I have not visited this development, so I am not educated on the successful design aspects of this project. If someone has suggestions on what is good and bad about this development, that would be helpful.

    The perspective is from the developer’s, in that what are good design aspects that result in higher sales per square foot.

  2. #2
    Cyburbian
    Registered
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Athens, Georgia
    Posts
    46
    I would say that Atlantic Station in Atlanta is an example of a large scale development of the sort you seek. How great they did is definitely up for debate. It has many nice features. My biggest complaint is that their way-finding is awful, making is extremely difficult to find the tucked away parking areas and even some of the bigger regional attractions like the exhibit spaces. And I have yet to visit IKEA without getting lost trying to find my way back to the interstate. But if you check them out more you might find it to be one for your list.

  3. #3
    Cyburbian Cardinal's avatar
    Registered
    Aug 2001
    Location
    The Cheese State
    Posts
    9,920
    The two best examples, from many that I have seen, are Bayshore Mall in the Milwaukee area, and Belmar in the Denver suburbs. Most others are little more than a conventional mall with a lifestyle appendage.
    Anyone want to adopt a dog?

  4. #4
    Cyburbian dvdneal's avatar
    Registered
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Remote command post at local bar
    Posts
    3,985
    Here are a few in my area:
    Westgate - Glendale, AZ - has a Cagbella's, 2 stadiums, and restaurant/entertainment/retail area
    Parc West - Peoria, AZ - has a theater and shops
    Desert Ridge - Phoenix, AZ - big box stores and a central retail area

    These are all in pretty typical suburban markets, except Glendale landed the stadiums.

  5. #5
    Cyburbia Administrator Dan's avatar
    Registered
    Mar 1996
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    14,552
    Blog entries
    3
    I was in the KC area during the early days of Legends at Village West. What contributed to the success of the center, IMHO, were:

    * Stores and restaurants that are unique to the region (Cabelas, Nebraska Furniture Mart, first branches of famous KC BBQ joints and steakhouses, and so on). It wasn't yet another lifestyle center with yet another Pottery Barn, Restoration Hardware, Apple Store, Z Gallerie and P.F. Chang's. It's rumored to be the location of Ikea when it enters the KC market. Stores and restaurants are generally affordable, even though part of the development is in the context of an upscale lifestyle center.

    * Combination with entertainment venues: Kansas Speedway/NASCAR, Schlitterbahn, Great Wolf Lodge, minor league baseball, and so on.

    The layout is half power center for the monster stores (Cabelas, NFM), half lifestyle center. It's still quite isolated from residential areas. Kansas City, Kansas/Wyandotte County is the poor cousin to KCMO, even though the Kansas-side suburbs (Overland Park, Olathe, Prairie Village, Lenexa, the various Mission whatevers, etc) are far more affluent than the 'burbs on the Missouri side (Independence, Lee's Summit, etc). Downtown KCK and surrounding neighborhoods were quite rough as of six years ago, and generally the population of KCK/Wyandotte is far more blue-collar than the region as a whole.

    The Canal Side project planned for downtown Buffalo is supposed to be an "urban Village West", if it ever gets off the ground.
    Growth for growth's sake is the ideology of the cancer cell. -- Edward Abbey

  6. #6
    Member
    Registered
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    2

    Thanks from Arenniks

    Thank you to everyone who has responded so far.

  7. #7
    Cyburbian
    Registered
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Ontario
    Posts
    29
    the Shops at Don Mills in Toronto is a brand-new Canadian example (the link is pictures of the first phase..1300 residential units to come).

    It's a redeveloped mall site, and it may not fit your criteria, but it does have modern design instead of a traditional / faux-European look, which I think looks really good (the modern design, that is)
    http://www.urbantoronto.ca/showpost....&postcount=113

  8. #8
    Cyburbian cdub's avatar
    Registered
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Nashville, TN
    Posts
    47
    I'll second Belmar near Denver as one of the better that's truly mixed use. The retail portion is done very well, but the residential is a bit lacking (except for some nice contemporary townhomes towards the rear.

    Belmar pics


    Stapleton, also in Denver, is half TND other half lifestyle center with the halves divided by the interstate. We'll have some photos next month of the lifestyle center, which has a small 'main street' and behind that big box (Target, Bass Proshop). Have yet to spend any time in the TND portion other than a quick drive through.

    Another that has more of a mixed use component is The Domain near Austin, TX.

    Domain pics

    Atlantic Station, mentioned previously, is a unique example as the entire development is built above a monstrous parking garage. Basically a pedestal from which everything else is built. The development is kind of odd in that you'll have a big box Target a block away from a 20 story residential tower, and most of the residential is pretty poorly done. There's also a new triumphant arch that's been built that I've yet to see, but has been getting good remarks.


    Atlantic Station pics


    More of a lifestyle center variety, Easton Town Center is a major retail site just outside Columbus, OH. Unfortunately it doesn't a mixed use component as the residential is separated from the main district. It has more of a feel of going to a Mills development as it's in a green-field area of town and you feel like you're lined up for an amusement park when arriving.

    Easton Pics

    Basic Lifestyle center examples on sitephocus.com:

    Lifestyle Center pics
    www.sitephocus.com ...get the picture

  9. #9
    Member
    Registered
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    1
    I also agree that Belmar is a good example of a destination retail development, although it is touted by the City of Lakewood as the new "town center." If you are interested in looking at financing redevelopment this may also be a nice case study as apparently it has been a successful use of a TIF district.

    Stapleton is often spoken of by devout New Urbanists as a wonderful example of New Urbanist Principles. However, what one would typically consider as supportive retail is far from what exists at Northfield Stapleton. While it is a destination center for NE Denver and surrounding suburbs and even smaller Eastern Plains communities, it is completely disconnected at the pedestrian scale from Stapleton itself.

    The Streets at SouthGlenn is almost completed and may provide a great example as a retail destination with big box retailers complemented by community uses such as the new library. My only real question at this point is how there is possibly a demand for the high quantity of multi-family housing that has been built.

  10. #10
    Cyburbian jmello's avatar
    Registered
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Clayobyrne, CB
    Posts
    2,581
    Check out this mixed-use development in our city. While it is not without drawbacks, the connectivity to existing neighborhoods was unprecidented. It was done by using traffic calming devices at all connections. Rounabouts were employed extensively.

    http://www.bing.com/maps/default.asp...9175&encType=1

  11. #11
    Cyburbian
    Registered
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Salt Lake City, UT
    Posts
    194
    Here are links to an old one -- Horton Plaza in San Diego and a new one -- The Gateway in Salt Lake City.

    Horton Plaza was one of the original downtown destination malls built in the late 1970's and early 1980's. Its a vertical outdoor mall -- very impressive.

    The Gateway is one of the new generation of mixed use downtown centers that is designed to be pedestrian oriented even in Salt Lake City's winters.

    http://www.shopthegateway.com/

    http://westfield.com/hortonplaza/

  12. #12
    Cyburbian
    Registered
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    611
    Westfield destroyed Horton Plaza.

    While Jon Jerde gets his share of criticism, many of his projects show a real understanding for how people actually relate to spaces. City Walk in Universal City and West Hollywood Gateway are some other good examples of successful retail developments that are not cookie-cutter lifestyle centers with faux-urbanism.

  13. #13
    Member
    Registered
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Fairfax, VA
    Posts
    8
    Well, the first place I thought of Atlantic Station, so there you go.

    One place I visited, but did not investigate in depth was Santana Row in San Jose, CA. We were using it as an example case for a redevelopment and I happened to notice it was right next to the Winchester Mystery House. So... Very upscale, but I suppose that is what Silicon valley will support. Like Atlantic Station and DC USA, it is built atop its parking. I'm sure the rents justified the parking.

    One of the follies was that it is flanked by I-280 and I-880. Our transportation engineers got excited by the 6-lane highways with median lefts and right accel/decel lanes. The design team, in getting the photo had cropped out the nearby interstates, and neglected to inform us of their presence. That'll teach me to settle on a pretty aerial without finding example in google maps.

    I can't exactly reccommend the Philadelphai Premium Outlets in Limerick, PA, as it is too suburban and parked up. For what it is, it may suit your client's needs. Threeadvantgaes: 1) it incorporates some LID principles in the central landscaping and parking area. 2) It is perfectly rotated so the honking cooling tower from the nearby Limerick nuclear power plant is not the central feature of that courtyard 3) It has a mixed ring circulation with a central courtyard/enclosed food court to keep the marks and the merch happy.

  14. #14
    Cyburbian jswanek's avatar
    Registered
    Dec 2009
    Location
    County of Orange
    Posts
    134
    Victoria Gardens in Rancho Cucamonga:

    http://www.victoriagardensie.com/

    Weird mix of titanic open parking lots on the "outside" and reasonably-sized "alley lots" "inside" the "town".

    Includes really nice spaces for outdoor small scale concerts, speechmaking, a library and playhouse as well as the usual commercial suspects.

    Since all the parking is private, and they don't want to tow customers, many motorists completely ignore time "limits" on the super-convenient town "streets" and alley parking.

    Something to consider.



    http://mallimages.mallfinder.com/ima...es/mallMap.pdf

  15. #15
    Cyburbian
    Registered
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    611
    While weekdays are manageable in the Victoria Gardens district, the interface between the pedestrians and the cars on the weekends is pretty bad.

    Without signalized intersections, non-stop streams of pedestrians cross the streets in every direction. The operators of the lifestyle center sometimes use removable bollards to pedestrianize the streets when everything starts to get out of hand, but I can't imagine the design working in real-world conditions.

  16. #16
    Cyburbian jswanek's avatar
    Registered
    Dec 2009
    Location
    County of Orange
    Posts
    134
    Quote Originally posted by Pragmatic Idealist View post
    While weekdays are manageable in the Victoria Gardens district, the interface between the pedestrians and the cars on the weekends is pretty bad.

    Without signalized intersections, non-stop streams of pedestrians cross the streets in every direction....I can't imagine the design working in real-world conditions.
    .

    I'm old enough (quite) to remember that in the '50s on "main street" or "broadway" in the older small towns where nothing was over 3-stories, everyone crossed in mid-block too, and those that still exist (like the Orange Circle) are now considered ideal neighborhoods where, still, everyone crosses in mid-block.

    So, you can't drive through a couple blocks at more than 2 miles an hour, big deal! The purpose of going "downtown" in these kinds of places IS to slow down!

    It's the idiota city councilmen that decided they needed four lanes of travel THROUGH their downtowns to "ease traffic" that thereby committed planning suicide.

    .

    .

  17. #17
    Cyburbian
    Registered
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    611
    More mid-block crossings at Victoria Gardens would certainly help. Then, fewer pedestrians would cross at the intersections and create the gridlock.

+ Reply to thread

More at Cyburbia

  1. Tax incentives for destination retail?
    Economic and Community Development
    Replies: 20
    Last post: 23 Oct 2009, 6:42 AM
  2. What is destination retail?
    Land Use and Zoning
    Replies: 19
    Last post: 30 Jan 2007, 3:07 PM
  3. Replies: 1
    Last post: 01 May 2000, 9:39 AM
  4. Replies: 1
    Last post: 01 May 2000, 9:31 AM