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Thread: DRI and transit mitigation

  1. #1
    Member
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    DRI and transit mitigation

    Hello,

    I am here again asking for some assistance. I previously request you guys to guide me, towards what would be the mitigation cost or developer obligation towards a new/ proposed Bus Rapid Transit Line/facility. I assume that you guys might havent come across this situation and that is the reason why my question wasnt answered.

    If you guys know of any jurisdiction that collects mitigation towards transit, Please let me know what jurisdiction it is, I will digg in to find out more answers.
    This isnt any thing new guys, I am sure I am not the first one to ask this question and there should be answer to it.

    Please give me any information that you can provide, you never know what might help some one.

    Thank you once again.

  2. #2
    Cyburbian
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    Broward County uses Transit Oriented Concurrency system

    Try looking into Broward County's system of Transit Oriented Concurrency. For projects located in the transit concurrency districts, developers would pay into the transit concurrency fund, which serves to make improvements to the transit system.

    Here is a link to a file that explains the system in a basic manner:

    http://www.broward.org/development/dmi00158.pdf

    Basically there are 8 districts, all identified on a map that the pdf references. Using the land use and the district a given project is located in, you can see what type of fee would be assessed in Broward for a given project type. While the fees are developed for their county, I suspect that using a similar methodology, one can come up with a more county or city-specific fee structure.

    Hopefully this helps.
    Last edited by Gatrgal93; 05 Jan 2010 at 6:17 PM.

  3. #3
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    Fist of I would like to thank you for responding. the document talks about the transportation concurrency Fee.. what I am looking for is Proportionate share Fee. This kinda says that the developer will be paying for the total trips during the Peak hour. (Intensity*Trip Rate* Trip Length * Cost per trip). The document talk about a fee , which I believe is similar to Impact fee.

    What I am looking for is a Transit mitigation similar to Roadway mitigation.
    Say a project adds 93 trips on a roadway and which makes the roadway to operate adversely and that roadway needs to be widened from 4l to 6l. The developer is responsible for a percentage of this widening cost which is equal to

    (Project Trips/Change is Service Volume)*Cost of Improvement

    in this case say 10% of the cost of improvement. My search is to find out what would be the formula towards the Transit Mitigation. Especially, if the county is planning to introduce Transit/Bus Rapid Transit System. Should the developer pay the for the entire cost of the Transit/ BRT line that passes through the Project Site or just a percentage of it. If it is percentage what would be the percentage.

    The one thing that become a hurdle is the percent of Transit Trips. How would you determine what percent of the Project Trips are Transit Trips?. The model probably would be the answer if there is a existing Transit Line, but what if the Transit Line is not existing but is being Proposed. I did run a model with the inclusion of proposed Transit Line and the trips turned out to be hardly one percent of the Project Trips.


    During my research I found a Presentation from FDOT which says it is willing to fund to estimate this Transit mitigation cost Formula/Calculation. I am trying to give the client an estimate of the Transit mitigation and want to base it on a reasonable assumptions.

    If any one can help me with discussing this that would be a great Help.

    Once again thanks for your response.

  4. #4
    Cyburbian
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    Nepotist,

    I know nothing about transit mitigation but to take a common sense approach wouldn't the developer be required to fund (pay into the overall transit project) an equal percentage as equivalent to how the project will impact the transit system?

    I may be confused with what you're asking but if the project causes the ADT to increase by 35% (post-development) then the proposed mitigation would be to fund 35% of the tranist or roadway improvement.

    I would not think that the developer is responsible for paying for the entire service which may have already been identified as a transportation improvement project by the jurisdiction.

    I wish I could point you to a study to prove this but after looking through the Georgia DOT I can find nothing that would be of value to you. We are behind when it comes to requiring developers mitigate the impacts of their projects on a large scale.

  5. #5
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    Shell ,
    you are right.it is correct in terms of Roadway. lets say that there is no transit facility available to the proposed development and we are not concerned about the transit. the developer percentage contribution towards the roadway mitigation would be calculated based on the formula that I posted in the previous post. Now that the DOTs are focusing on the multi-modal , they would also expect developers to pay towards the transit too.

    How would you calculate the percent of project trips that would use Transit?. Worst case scenario this might be some percentage which the developer and the county would mutually agree to.(and usually they pull this number out of nowhere). If I have to use a formula smilar to the one above.. what would be the change in the capacity/service volume. would it be a percentage of number of seats in a 45' Modern Bus.
    How would you consider the headway of the transit in to this.

    Somany question but I dont have answers.

  6. #6
    Cyburbian
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    Nepotist,

    I'll pose your question to my RDC representative and see what formula they come up with. You may be correct is taking a random number from the average seat count on a typical transit bus.

  7. #7
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    Thanks Shell

  8. #8
    Cyburbian
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    Quote Originally posted by nepotist View post
    Fist of I would like to thank you for responding. the document talks about the transportation concurrency Fee.. what I am looking for is Proportionate share Fee. This kinda says that the developer will be paying for the total trips during the Peak hour. (Intensity*Trip Rate* Trip Length * Cost per trip). The document talk about a fee , which I believe is similar to Impact fee.

    What I am looking for is a Transit mitigation similar to Roadway mitigation.
    Say a project adds 93 trips on a roadway and which makes the roadway to operate adversely and that roadway needs to be widened from 4l to 6l. The developer is responsible for a percentage of this widening cost which is equal to

    (Project Trips/Change is Service Volume)*Cost of Improvement

    in this case say 10% of the cost of improvement. My search is to find out what would be the formula towards the Transit Mitigation.
    Broward bases Transit Oriented Concurrency fees on trip generation. These are essentially impact fees and at the same time, are Proportionate Share fees since they are charging you only for the impacts you create, and your fair share to make improvements, in this case - the improvements that get made aren't about expanding roads from 4L to 6L, but rather funding things like BRT.

    Basically, Broward's basis is still grounded in the trips a given use generates, and then mitigating for those trips by paying a proportionate share cost into a fund that serves to upgrade/improve transit systems, thereby taking the trips off the road.

    Should the developer pay the for the entire cost of the Transit/ BRT line that passes through the Project Site or just a percentage of it. If it is percentage what would be the percentage.
    I would think based on the concept of Rational Nexus, and also on Florida's Growth Management Law, you would absolutely have to require only a percentage of the cost, or am I missing something here?

    How would you determine what percent of the Project Trips are Transit Trips?.
    Good question. I think that in Broward's system of Transit Oriented Concurrency they are using some specific factor for that percentage ... I'd have to look at it more ... I have a contact at the county - maybe I could ask her how they come up with that.
    Last edited by Gatrgal93; 08 Jan 2010 at 6:28 PM. Reason: additional response

  9. #9
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    I cant help to think that there might be a flaw in this way broward way of charging Developers towards BRT. or I am missing something.

    As per my understanding.. they charger for the trips generation of the project. (entire trips generated?). If they are charging for the entire trip generation well that doesn't sound right, aren't they charging for the roadway mitigation as well?

    I might sound a bit dumb here, but I am trying to apply the same concept of Roadway mitigation in order for the transit mitigation.

    Lets consider a roadway which is impacted by the project trips and requires a widening from 4L to 6L. and the developer pays his share based on the formula as mentioned in the previous post. Now consider a BRT (with dedicated Transit Lanes/busways) Here my capacity is in terms of number of Buses but not actually number of Bus lanes. As there is a existing BRT(dedicated lanes aavilable the developer would add more buses so as to reduce the headway.

    The interesting question would be, what if there is no existing BRT(Dedicated Transit lane/busway). Should the developer pay for the construction of the busways for the entire proposed BRT line or only for the portions that passes through the project site or just provide the dedicated Right of Way and also should he be paying for the Buses.

    If he has to pay towards the construction of the dedicated transit lanes, then other developers after him, would be just paying towards the buses which costs less.

    The more I think about it , more the questions pop up and lead me no where, or am I missing something important?

  10. #10
    Cyburbian
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    The way I understand Broward's Transit based concurrency fees to work is that the county adopts 5-year Transit Development Plans (TDP) for the Transit based concurrency districts, much like a 5-Year CIP for roads and other infrastructure.

    The 5-year TDP outlines the improvements to the transit system in each district. A dollar cost figure is attached to the TDP improvements. A per trip cost for development within each district is calculated, and as new development comes in, the county uses the trip generation data for each new project as the basis to assign a transit oriented concurrency fee to the developer.

    The developer then pays into the transit concurrency fund for that district, and the county uses the funds within the district to fund various projects. The developer does not additionally pay road impact fees as stated in the one page description of the program. The transit concurrency fee is the only fee they are obligated to pay if they are in one of those districts, and additionally, if they do not have a platted property that already assigned development rights (another matter entirely) to the site.

    In any case, the developer is paying his/her "fair share" cost of developing in the county. Instead of putting the money into specific road improvements (building new roads or widening existing roads), the county funds transit improvements with those dollars.

    It's basically a pay and go system. The developer isn't held to a specific transit improvement - just a payment to fund improvements within the district - the county decides where and when.

    Hope that helps clarify a bit ...

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