The First 2012 Presidential Election Thread

[Blide]

I think the power elite has targeted Cain, as he is not one of their horses.

I honestly don't think this is the case here. He's imploding all on his own. He knew this would likely come to light but did nothing to prepare for it. He's been denying it for the last week which is just feeding the media circus around him. He's doing just about everything he shouldn't be doing in this situation.

Also the names of the first victims are known to the media, they're just not being disclosed for privacy reasons. So this wasn't some anonymous smear campaign either. Then now that this fourth lady has come out and accused him, it'll only go deal hill from here. Particularly with this fourth lady, what does she really have to gain for going public anyway other than to expose the truth?

[ofos]

I honestly don't think this is the case here. He's imploding all on his own. He knew this would likely come to light but did nothing to prepare for it. He's been denying it for the last week which is just feeding the media circus around him. He's doing just about everything he shouldn't be doing in this situation.

Also the names of the first victims are known to the media, they're just not being disclosed for privacy reasons. So this wasn't some anonymous smear campaign either. Then now that this fourth lady has come out and accused him, it'll only go deal hill from here. Particularly with this fourth lady, what does she really have to gain for going public anyway other than to expose the truth?

Don't you have to wonder just a little bit about purity of motives when anyone shows up with "celebrity attorney" Gloria Allred?

[fringe]

"...He's doing just about everything he shouldn't be doing in this situation..."

Does not sound like leadership quality of thinking. Just like GW and Co did everything they should not have done in response to 9-11.

Politicians are among the most deluded of us. It is not that they are disingenuous. They honestly cannot see what is wrong with their thinking. That is why their baldface lies are delivered sincerely.

[Blide]

Don't you have to wonder just a little bit about purity of motives when anyone shows up with "celebrity attorney" Gloria Allred?

I'll admit that's a bit odd but there could many reasons for that. I just don't see what she has to gain by coming forward since she's risking her career and creditability in order to do that. It's not like she's even in a position to blackmail Cain anymore or to have him pay her off. She should be wise enough to know that her 15 minutes of fame probably won't pay off monetarily. So I can only assume that there's at least some truth to what she's saying.

[Raf]

Don't you have to wonder just a little bit about purity of motives when anyone shows up with "celebrity attorney" Gloria Allred?

Agreed. I am no fan of mr. 9-9-9, however when you show up with Gloria in toe, there are some questions one should ask:

1. Who is paying to retain ms. allred?
2. Did aldred approach her, or did she seek allred out?
3. What if any financial gain is set up for her to do "interviews"?

I am not calling her a liar, but those were some pretty graphic details to put out there. There is lots of financial gains to be made between interviews and the such, so I don't buy the whole "won't pay off" thing. There is a reason why the others haven't come forward (settlement reasons chiefly) but again, i question motives for her specifically.

One thing is for sure, he sure did screw this thing up the way he handled it. Acknowledge, it, provide a mi culpa, apologize profusely, make sure wife is there when apology is said, and than move on to the real "issues" like building electric fences around the mexican border filled with moats with gators. How hard is that?

[Blide]

Definitely a valid point but we'll just have to wait and see. Like I honestly don't even know how much she'd make off interviews. I also don't know if those interviews would be enough to counteract all the dirty laundry the media is digging up on her. She definitely has a history of financial issues that could easily be used to discredit her so who knows.

[imaplanner]

Allred is always suspect for motives, but AFAIK everyone that she represents has later been found to be telling the truth. Regardless, the two settled claims that he first lied about and then refused to discuss pretty much are all you need to know there is some truth to all these other accusations. A third, fourth and now possibly a fifth woman accusing him all the while he is refusing to answer any questions? Cmon.

[Hink]

John McCain predicts 'fed up' 3rd party
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1111/67930.html

Best line:

The tea party was a movement, not an organization, as we know. And so they’ve kind of receded. There was never any permanency to them.

I agree. I hope for our country that we have a 3rd party that focuses on the middle 50% of the spectrum. Moderates can win elections. They just have a hard time fundraising. We need a group of wealthy individuals (Huntsman, Bloomberg, etc.) that can fund their own elections and stick a new label on themselves like the American Party, Even Party, or No Labels Party. Whatever it is called, get candidates to use the name and start to get money in a fund that can run like the R's and D's. With such small war chests, the RNC, and DNC aren't exactly far ahead... all they have is name recognition.

[Blide]

He's definitely uninformed if he thinks that somehow the Tea Party and OWS will coalesce into a single party. They both may be fed up but they're diametrically opposed on what the role of government should be.

I'd love to see a moderate party but I just don't see it happening now. If anything, I think the Democrats are actually the moderate party now. If new parties emerge, they'll probably be more extreme than their current counterparts. Like I can definitely see disenfranchised conservatives moving into the Constitution Party. They actually had a real strong showing in Colorado's last governor's race where they took 36% of the vote with Tom Tancredo. It was pretty funny too since the split conservative vote spent more time bickering among themselves than actually running against the Democrat, so Hickenlooper won easily.

Then I have to say, Cain continues to impress me with how bad he's handling the sexual harassment allegations. Real classy trying to personally discredit an individual for making the allegations. His argument basically sounded like "she's poor so she can't possibly be telling the truth."

[WSU MUP Student]

Tonight's Republican debate is taking place at one of my alma maters. Even though I doubt I would vote for any of the participants in the presidential election, I still thought it would be fun to actually attend the debate. I looked into tickets a few months ago and apparently the ones that were available for alumni were grabbed up in a matter of hours.

Oh well. I'll have to set my DVR and head to bowling instead.

[Tarf]

Cain is claiming the whole sex scandal is the product of the "democratic machine".

Seriously? Someone should maybe point out to Cain how all the democratic organizations are spending their money producing ads against Romney. Nothing would please democrats more than Cain beating Romney in the primaries, as Cain has no chance whatsoever in the general given his rather extreme positions on a number of issues (including tax policy favoring the rich).

[Whose Yur Planner]

Tonight's Republican debate is taking place at one of my alma maters. Even though I doubt I would vote for any of the participants in the presidential election, I still thought it would be fun to actually attend the debate. I looked into tickets a few months ago and apparently the ones that were available for alumni were grabbed up in a matter of hours.

Oh well. I'll have to set my DVR and head to bowling instead.

There's a debate tonight? Haven't they pretty much ground their "issues" into mush by now?

[Tarf]

Oh my... looks like Perry just completed his total implosion at tonight's debate. Stick a fork in him, he's done.

Check out the video - it's hilarious!

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1111/68025.html

[Hink]

Boy it is getting down to the few, the proud... and Romney.

Pawlenty
Santorum
Bachmann
Perry
Cain
Gingrich
Romney

Never had a chance...
Paul
Huntsman

[Planit]

Oh my... looks like Perry just completed his total implosion at tonight's debate. Stick a fork in him, he's done.

Check out the video - it's hilarious!

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1111/68025.html

I don't claimed to be the most politically knowledgeble person about the various necessities of federal departments, but when you want to eliminate the depts. of Commerce, Education, and um oops (it is Energy) - aren't those pretty big deals which translate into essential services and needs?

Ecomonic Development = jobs, business, free enterprise, small businesses, etc.
Schools = an intelligent workforce, retraining, product research & development, etc.
Power = viable businesses, oil dependency, foreign govts., alternate power, etc.

Then he wants to rebuild EPA...

Am I missing something?

[Blide]

I believe he thinks all those functions should be handled by the states. To me, that just shows a fundamental misunderstanding of what these federal departments do.

[mgk920]

I believe he thinks all those functions should be handled by the states. To me, that just shows a fundamental misunderstanding of what these federal departments do.

Well, there still are Article I, Section 8 and the Tenth Amendment to consider. The last that I checked, they were still part of the text of the USA's Constitution. Are those functions in fact Constitutionally delegated powers of Congress?

I don't just brush those questions off as being 'quaint' and 'old fashioned', either.

Mike

[hilldweller]

I believe he thinks all those functions should be handled by the states. To me, that just shows a fundamental misunderstanding of what these federal departments do.

He doesn't even know what he thinks. Just a complete and utter moron incapable of intelligent thought.

[Blide]

Well, there still are Article I, Section 8 and the Tenth Amendment to consider. The last that I checked, they were still part of the text of the USA's Constitution. Are those functions in fact Constitutionally delegated powers of Congress?

I'll just use the Commerce Department as an example. That department performs many functions that are mandated by the Constitution, most notably in regards to patents, trade, and the census. Anyone calling for its removal clearly doesn't know what that department's function is.

[mgk920]

I'll just use the Commerce Department as an example. That department performs many functions that are mandated by the Constitution, most notably in regards to patents, trade, and the census. Anyone calling for its removal clearly doesn't know what that department's function is.

That's why I carefully used the word 'functions'. Regulating commerce between the states was their reason why the DoC was created. 'Function creep' created the mess that we have now.

Mike

[Dan]

Boy it is getting down to the few, the proud... and Romney.

Pawlenty
Santorum
Bachmann
Perry
Cain
Gingrich
Romney

Never had a chance...
Paul
Huntsman

Who?
Johnson

As a liberal, I didn't have the same "wow, what a failure" reaction to Perry's gaffe as my peers. The electorate wants their presidential candidates to be perfect, it seems, and to me it just looked like a normal brain fart at an inopportune time; something most of us have experienced. It's being blown way out of proportion.

That being said, he's nuts for wanting to get rid of the agencies he named.

[Blide]

That's why I carefully used the word 'functions'. Regulating commerce between the states was their reason why the DoC was created. 'Function creep' created the mess that we have now.

I understand completely what you're saying. It just seems like these calls for removing specific departments is akin to using a hatchet in a situation where a scalpel is necessary. Then when you consider that some of the function creep isn't necessarily a bad thing, it makes those calls seem even more inappropriate. Like I don't think you'll find many people complaining that the National Weather Service is an unnecessary function creep of the Commerce Department. I think they'd sound a lot more credible if they targeted specific agencies and not whole departments.

[imaplanner]

wow. That was painful to watch. At least he didn't dust of the ol "gotcha question from the lamestream media" excuse. But still- totally wow.

[btrage]

I used to be a HUGE politics junkie. But over the last year or so, I've found myself caring less and less about national politics. At this point, I may not even vote in the next Presidential election.

[imaplanner]

I used to be a HUGE politics junkie. But over the last year or so, I've found myself caring less and less about national politics. At this point, I may not even vote in the next Presidential election.

I haven't stopped caring, but I have had a major shift in how I care. I pay attention, but I know its all a huge cluster that I have no power to change, and I have stopped trying to change anyone else's mind because politics seems to turn people's heads into mush. I used to get so frustrated talking to seemingly intelligent people who become complete and utter morons when it comes to politics. I also am likely not going to vote in the next election - primarily because for all the posturing and political brain-mushing, Romney is exactly the same as Obama. There is no difference between the two- and I'm going to just sit back and watch the brain-mushers tear the other side apart as the antichrist when in reality they are exactly the same.