The problem is that it would be stand alone. Something regarding ACA would be attached to it. The only reason they are doing this is in order to save some face.Originally posted by michaelskis
The problem is that it would be stand alone. Something regarding ACA would be attached to it. The only reason they are doing this is in order to save some face.
When did I go from Luke Skywalker to Obi-Wan Kenobi?
As those who work for the park service how that would help. Or the other departments and agencies that could be funded. The entire government might not get funded for a while, but at least some departments would get funding and programs like wic will sill operate.
But instead, the senate and the house Demicrats are now telling individual agencies that their stance on the healthcare bill is more important then the work they do and the people they help.
Me: "I am sorry, but the Ordinance and the Master Plan does not permit that at this time. But if you would like to request amendments, this 355 page document outlines the procedure. You will need…. (CLIPPED TO ACCOMMODATE LIMIT) …. It will likely take 36 to 48 months to get final approvals. Then you can submit for a building permit and break ground Would you like to get started with the process?
Applicant: "Geeze, a simple No you can't do that would have worked"
The whole shutdown and debt ceiling is a hostage situation. Do what we want or the economy gets it. If a man sticks a gun at you and says give me all your money and you say no and then he says fine give me half your money and you say no, Mskis would have you believe that you are the one being unreasonable for not compromising.
Budgets simply can't be funded this way. The government functioning and upholding its duties and duly elected laws, all of them, is how government works. The whole premise behind the GOP position is that not funding and not raising the debt ceiling is bad, and that unless the democrats agree to things that the GOP has been unable to achieve through the democratic process, the GOP will make those bad things happen. You simply cannot reward hostage takers or the democratic process will no longer exist.
What skis and his fellow republicans are defending would set in motion constant crises in government. Democrats woukd threaten to blow up the economy if a republican president didn't do what they couldn't achieve in the democratic process. If, say, democrats refused to fund the government except for the park service unless the top tax rate was raised to 90%? Well, skis and his cohorts would rightly condemn the hostage taking excercise as both undemocratic and dangerous. I suppose this is where the cognitive bias comes into play with our friend here. He is simply unable to make the connection that since this would be an outrage if democrats did it it should be outrage that republicans are doing it. I'm starting to believe I've been too harsh on our friend here. His inability to think rationally deserves my sympathy rather than my scorn.
Children in the back seat can cause accidents - and vice versa.
Because this is a disingenuous position. There are the votes in the House to pass a clean CR. Who are the House Republicans to decide what agencies stay open or closed? We don't fund budgets in this country based on a popularity contest. As I have said time and time again in this thread, just because the EPA doesn't do the most glamorous work doesn't make their work any less important.
I don't understand why the GOP is so concerned with dismantling a properly passed law that has been found to be constitutional? This would be like if the democrats pitched a fit and refused to fund the government over their dislike of something like the Patriot Act. The only one who is responsible for this shutdown right now is John Boehner. If he would bring a clean bill to the House floor it would pass, the Senate would pass it, and the President would sign it. This shutdown could be over in two hours but John Boehner would rather drag this out in order to try to score some political points. I can't wait to hear the defense on this!
Your pretend ignorance is tiresome.
You know quite well, that it is the Houses plan B strategy that accomplishes the exact same initial goal that did not work. It's not a secret and it is not sneaky smart. It is also not compromise.
The GOP does not want to fund the parks, they want to sell them off for pennies on the dollar for logging or to privatize them. Your pretend position is a sham.
The GOP does not care about kids with cancer. If they did, they would not have shut the government down to prevent people from getting ACA health care. Your pretend position is a lie
The GOP does not care about kids on the WIC program. You often state your adherence to the policies of your soulless leadership in trying to slash/defund that and similar policies.
The GOP does not care about putting food on poor peoples plate. You fully stand behind policies of slashing/defunding anything to help people with few resources.
The GOP does not care or want to support science. Good science makes the world more difficult for the Judeo/Christian/Islamic world view (they are the same religion with different stages of reform). The world is NOT 10,000 years old.
The GOP does not care about the environment. They would repeal over 100 years of environmental protection. They want the Cuyahoga river to burn again, kill thousands of people with breathing issues and kill every animal possible. Reference your belief that lead in your environment is ok.
The GOP does not care about childrens edgukashon. If they can't be taught by christian religious zealots, they should not be educated.
The GOP does not want government. Period. You have wrongly stated that all government is bad and the bigger the government gets the worse it gets. Statements that are demonstrably wrong on every level
etc....
You claim to be pro-life at every opportunity and argue that no public money should be used to fund something you disagree with. That behavior is called acting like a spoiled child. Each one of us here doesn't like something the government spends money on in one place or another but we don't insist or support trying to destroy the government or world economy over it. It is also called compromise and negotiation. Once a child enters this world, you don't give a rats ass about them or what happens to them. Not with any kind of basics, not food, housing, or education. By supporting your GOP leaders in helping to obfuscate the issues above, you help to sustain a situation that devalues human life and ACTIVELY works to harm it. Society OWES those children, ALL children, at least a shot at the opportunity to live a good life. By supporting several of the amendments made in this government shutdown by the House republicans, like the change to the ACA that would let ANY business person or business based on religious belief, decide insurance coverage for a defenseless employee. All your moral statements are not truly held beliefs. You know what that is called.
Why the last paragraph? You are worried about the parks. You are worried about the whiny Vets that might not get to see their stone slab. Bo Hooo! Do you care about those using the WIC program? Didn't think so. How about the SNAP program? Didn't think so. How about real programs the vets could actually use? Didn't think so. Bet you didn't hear about the $ 6 BILLION $ the GOP is trying to cut from the VA budget last Friday? Didn't think so. Your priorities are so out of wack it is no longer funny.
Using your argument, once all of these issues are passed one at a time, the ACA stands alone and you believe you can then kill it. You insult all of us. You are not sneaky smart and we are not that dumb. The House tried to fund the government without the ACA funding. It is what started the government shut down and we will not forget that fact. As long as the democratic party hangs tough It is not working and it will not work. Yet you attempt to argue it as if it is perfectly reasonable. It is not.
The votes are there to pass a clean CR. Now that makes sense. Then, like the DEM party has been asking for almost 6 months, the senate conference committee should sit down with the House conference committee and hammer out the reconciliation budget. It's called regular order. The continuing resolution would give them 6 weeks. The GOP house does not want to do this because it would mean compromise.
The House needs to stop the gimmicks and actually get to the table and work things out. Everyone agrees (70%) that the medical device tax is likely to be stripped out of the ACA. OK, it can go, but the ACA is clearly going to work, so if there is an issue, DEM's & GOP can FIX the issues. Killing it is not compromise. What don't you get about that? Its first grade. Oh, yeah. Playing dumb is the order of the day.
Maybe he is as clueless as he seems. Maybe he doesn't realize that singular short term spending authorizations is a tactic to get to the same point as the original defunding of the ACA the House passed. However, that is improbable. Seeing as he already admitted to trolling once today.
I can't deliver UTOPIA, but I can create a HELL for you to LIVE in :)DoD:(
HEADLINE: Obama, Dems mock Indiana lawmaker's budget remark
http://www.courierpress.com/news/201...budget-remark/
Stutzman:
"We're not going to be disrespected. We have to get something out of this. And I don't know what that even is."
Oddball
Why don't you knock it off with them negative waves?
Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here?
Why don't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?
From Kelly's Heroes (1970)
Are you sure you're not hurt ?
No. Just some parts wake up faster than others.
Broke parts take a little longer, though.
From Electric Horseman (1979)
Textbook definition of acting like a child. Its like you not liking ice cream, seeing another kid getting ice cream, and screaming you want ice cream. Tough cookies, life isn't fair. This is something you learn in kindergarten. You would think the GOP would be for children's health and nutrition, since they are proving that for the most part they are no better than a 5 year old. I hope people will remember this in 2014, yet knowing the American people we will forget about these antics.
As of the time I write this, the GOP is completly leaving the defunding of the ACA by the roadside. They havn't mentioned it all day.
Tonight, some A-hole GOP member got up in front of a bunch of journalists and said "I have an idea to end the standoff. just don't tell anybody who I am". http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/1...n_4039761.html
They cant manage to take down the ACA, so NOW they are thinking they can go after GRANDMA! Thats swell you idiots. Go after the hand that feeds. I bet that trial balloon drops like its made of lead. This "anonymous" sourcing has to stop.
Nice Quote:
"Sequester is a very blunt instrument," the GOP member said. "It's a pretty common view among Republicans that we've done way too much. So some of the spending can be restored. ... Then the president's going to get some of what he wants, for domestic initiatives, Head Start and whatever."
They are admitting they took to much money out of the economy, and now retirees are supposed to dig their sorry behinds out of trouble? I just can't imagine how the GOP can't tell how tone def they are? To some it up, Republican dirt bags are trying to push no health care for anybody,retirees get to much, the poor rich people are taxed to much, and workers get paid to well because of minimum wage. I would laugh at this but I am too busy picking my jaw up off the floor. It is all about face saving now. There is no argument about reducing debt or defunding the ACA. Its just pure face saving now. Or in the case of the GOP that would be the same as covering their buts. You would think old people would pop their heads out of their posteriors and realize the people they vote for are NOT on their side. That smell is called "DESPERATION" and the GOP should go clean it out of their shorts.
OH, and John Boehner signaled he would not default on the debt. That one is on hold though, as he is the most spineless speaker in ALL of our American history.
Message to Democratic leadership? Get a deal, but it had better be 98% of what we want, that will make it even for last year over the holidays when thats what Boehner got in his own words. Get a guaranteed budget with higher numbers than accepted in the House, an extension of the debt ceiling through January of 15, and give up the medical device tax and not 1 thing more.
I can't deliver UTOPIA, but I can create a HELL for you to LIVE in :)DoD:(
My hope is that some in the GOP are beginning to realize that the GOP leadership is bat sh*t crazy and would rather destroy their party for this false notion that if they compromise they lose. It is beginning to appear that many in the party are realizing that hitching their fortunes to Boehner is foolish and will end up with their asses getting booted out in '14. Boehner is spineless and has lost control of his party. If the end result wasn't an ongoing government shutdown and this constant governing by crisis, I would be standing by with my popcorn watching the tea party destroying the modern Republican party. Unless the GOP changes course very soon, they are going to watch themselves locked out for the next 10-15 years. I honestly think that if it wasn't for voter suppression and gerrymandering they would have been dead in 2012.
I'm wondering if they aren't crazy, just have a different problem to handle.
Most of the Teas have the opinion of making the government smaller. It is a fair idea, I don't really agree entirely with it, but to say that a smaller government is bad is incorrect. It is all opinions after all. They're problem is that they are fresh and new and brought in with a certain mission and they just are willing to understand that politics is an imperfect game and you can't just make demands and get them. So whether or not their opinions are valid is irrelevant because they are acting ridiculous and counter to the political process.
The rest of the GOP knows this, but they also know that if they don't back this lunacy next year they're going to get serious primary challenges.
So in effect the Teas are holding the mainstream GOP hostage as well as the national political process.
I consider myself some-what right-leaning (at least by comparison to a lot of the folks on here), but this shit is ridiculous. I don't have too much money, but next year I intend to send campaign donations to swing districts against people who supported this nonsense of a shutdown and potential default.
There is a problem with splitting Teabaggers and "regular" GOP members. There is no way the Teabaggers could primary every single GOP congressman. If the teabaggers tried to primary that many congressman ~180, there wouldn't be enough money to effectively attack them all, so their message would fail. Result: Major Teabagger defeat.
Teabagger success in primarying what is thought of as a "normal" GOP congressman destroys the GOP as a national force. Result: Catastrophic Teabagger and GOP Defeat.
As a side note, that would be a great thing for Democrats because the majorities picked up nationwide would be astounding. Independents and a few anonymous GOP types, do not like the teabaggers.
This is why I say there is a problem determining a difference between the lot. This split sounds good but in reality it is only a difference in degree and not actual governing philosophy, tactics not actual strategy.
I can't deliver UTOPIA, but I can create a HELL for you to LIVE in :)DoD:(
The GOP is a bunch of idiots and Reid has said that the medical device tax will stay. I don't care what the GOP does or does not believe... They are almost as bad as the democrats. Once again, you keep saying You... Last I checked, I am not a member of congress.
I would also love for someone to explain who will be paying for all of this?
Has the republicans proposed independent funding bills? Yes. But the democrats rather run this country into the ground and refuse to compromise on anything. You seem to be good with that idea which is sad.
Me: "I am sorry, but the Ordinance and the Master Plan does not permit that at this time. But if you would like to request amendments, this 355 page document outlines the procedure. You will need…. (CLIPPED TO ACCOMMODATE LIMIT) …. It will likely take 36 to 48 months to get final approvals. Then you can submit for a building permit and break ground Would you like to get started with the process?
Applicant: "Geeze, a simple No you can't do that would have worked"
Everything is effed. Obama is an unmitigated disaster. The GOP congress might be worse. Might be time to move to Canada, if they let me in.
The votes are there to raise the debt ceiling, Boehner says it would be disasterous for our economy and the national security of our country if we dont raise the debt ceiling, and he acknowledges the GOP and Obama both have equal reason to want to raise the debt ceiling and prevent the damage to America but Boehner also says he wont allow a vote on raising the debt ceiling unless obama gives the republicans something but he doesnt know exactly what he wants. Wow.
And this is Obama's fault and he hates America because he is refusing to give the republican party what they want so they wont crash the economy even though they don't even know what they want. Wow.
Children in the back seat can cause accidents - and vice versa.
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