Urban planning community

+ Reply to thread
Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: Apply to jobs that are not local

  1. #1
    Member
    Registered
    Mar 2010
    Location
    So. Cal
    Posts
    24

    Apply to jobs that are not local

    This may have been discussed elsewhere in the forum at another point, but I'm curious about the following:

    What's the protocol for applying to jobs beyond local employment options? Particularly, if one is applying from an opposite coast, is it tremendously unlikely that anything will materialize simply based on the distance involved; even if the applicant states that they are willing to move cross-country at their expense?

    With so much uncertainty in the marketplace, it's tough to pick up and move, only to potentially get stonewalled yet again in another market. I'm wondering if anyone has thoughts on this.

  2. #2
    Cyburbian
    Registered
    Dec 2006
    Location
    midwest
    Posts
    2,789
    Focus on earning the interview first, wherever it is. You can decide whether you want to relocate AFTER you have EARNED the letter of offer. The last time I was unemployed in 2009 I was flown out, at company expense, for 4 jobs. I moved 750 miles to Wichita, KS where I didn't know anyone, worked my tail off at the firm and in my free time put together an entire state planning conference, all within a year. Then I was laid off this January. Realizing there was absolutely no planning work in Wichita, I hightailed out of that city in 2 weeks and moved down to Houston without a job in hand. Moved in with a friend, later moved into my own apartment, and am still busy with the job search, although focusing in a different career path (turned down one non-planning offer last month).

    I have always been a huge supporter of relocating for work. Not everyone can do it easily.
    "This is great, honey. What's the crunchy stuff?"
    "M&Ms. I ran out of paprika."

    Family Guy

  3. #3
    Cyburbian HomerJ's avatar
    Registered
    Dec 2010
    Location
    I'm gettin' there
    Posts
    925
    Well, to be honest, it probably isn't going to help your chances. But you won't really know what kind of factor it's going to play until after the fact. Since the majority of positions accept electronic submissions, it's not any additional burden on you to apply, so go for it. The question you have to ask is:

    "Am I qualified for this job?"

    And

    "How can I stand out as a candidate?"

    Those should at least be your primary concerns and meanwhile location should be a secondary concern.
    Insanity in individuals is something rare - but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule.

  4. #4
    Cyburbian Cardinal's avatar
    Registered
    Aug 2001
    Location
    The Cheese State
    Posts
    9,920
    Looking for work outside of your region becomes easier with more experience. It may not be as attractive for an employer to interview candidates from a distance for an entry-level slot, but for a director's position it is not at all uncommon. In my 2003-4 search I was flown to Washington, California, Missouri, Colorado, and New Mexico, all at the city's expense. Later I paid to fly out candidates for senior level jobs. The market has changed somewhat since then, but especially if you volunteer to foot the bill, there should be no reason wht distance would keep you from being considered.
    Anyone want to adopt a dog?

  5. #5
    Cyburbian Tarf's avatar
    Registered
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Encinitas, CA
    Posts
    705
    Just another thought...

    Seeing as how you're from Southern California, I'd probably encourage you to look locally first. You live in one of the easiest states in the country to land a planning-related job, even in this economy. Also, California is large, and skill sets needed in southern California are no different from northern CA, meaning you'll be competitive for any position throughout the state (may want to mention in your cover letter that you're not seeking compensation for moving, though, unless you are).
    In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. (Douglas Adams)

  6. #6
    Cyburbian Raf's avatar
    Registered
    Feb 2007
    Location
    America's Happiest City
    Posts
    4,903
    Quote Originally posted by Cardinal View post
    Looking for work outside of your region becomes easier with more experience. It may not be as attractive for an employer to interview candidates from a distance for an entry-level slot, but for a director's position it is not at all uncommon. In my 2003-4 search I was flown to Washington, California, Missouri, Colorado, and New Mexico, all at the city's expense.
    Agreed. During my last job search I was flown out to the east coast for a senior planner position, a 3K trek across country. I was only considered based on my strength of resume, and phone interview. Don't hesitate to cast your net wider, however with no real experience, it may be a feather in the wind. Good luck.
    Men do dumb $hit... it is what they do to correct the problem that counts.

  7. #7
    Cyburbian Brocktoon's avatar
    Registered
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Promoting synergies...
    Posts
    3,558
    Quote Originally posted by Cardinal View post
    Looking for work outside of your region becomes easier with more experience. It may not be as attractive for an employer to interview candidates from a distance for an entry-level slot, but for a director's position it is not at all uncommon. In my 2003-4 search I was flown to Washington, California, Missouri, Colorado, and New Mexico, all at the city's expense. Later I paid to fly out candidates for senior level jobs. The market has changed somewhat since then, but especially if you volunteer to foot the bill, there should be no reason wht distance would keep you from being considered.
    This is a great piece of advice. I wanted to move back to Arizona from Washington, DC and the only reason I got interviewed was because I offered to fly out at my expense.
    "If you don't like change, you're going to like irrelevance even less" General Eric Shinseki

  8. #8
    Member
    Registered
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Front Range, Colorado
    Posts
    8
    If you are from Southern California, I think most employers in California (I used to work at a firm in SF and was involved in hiring decisions) WOULD consider you local, if you are looking for relocation within-state.

  9. #9
    Member
    Registered
    Mar 2010
    Location
    So. Cal
    Posts
    24

    thanks!

    I want to thank everyone for their responses/insights. Basically, I haven't struck gold (or silver or bronze) in So Cal as of yet, with a lot of searching. I'm willing to make an about-face and leave for a couple of other areas in the country and I figured I would start sending resumes as I see jobs come available. I just wanted to know what I would be up against, but it seems if I make it 100% clear that I am willing to foot any bill for interviewing and ultimately moving, I can potentially get some of the same consideration as local candidates (as long as my resume stacks up well). Thanks again!

  10. #10
    Cyburbian cng's avatar
    Registered
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Greater Los Angeles
    Posts
    207
    Keep in mind that California is one of the hardest-hit states during this recession. Also, local governments have tightened their budgets tremendously, as a result of lower property values, decreased sales revenue, and the State of California eliminating redevelopment agencies. You will come across public senior/management level planning positions in California as a result of workers leaving for retirement, but your best bet is to start off somewhere outside of this state.

  11. #11
    Cyburbian Brocktoon's avatar
    Registered
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Promoting synergies...
    Posts
    3,558
    Quote Originally posted by cng View post
    Keep in mind that California is one of the hardest-hit states during this recession. Also, local governments have tightened their budgets tremendously, as a result of lower property values, decreased sales revenue, and the State of California eliminating redevelopment agencies. .
    Off-topic:
    I thought redevelopment agencies were allowed to remain if they paid a percentage to the state and then agreed to pay a tithe to the state for allowing them to exist...or was that a compromise that did not materialize?
    "If you don't like change, you're going to like irrelevance even less" General Eric Shinseki

  12. #12
    Cyburbian dw914er's avatar
    Registered
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    1,120
    Quote Originally posted by Brocktoon View post
    Off-topic:
    I thought redevelopment agencies were allowed to remain if they paid a percentage to the state and then agreed to pay a tithe to the state for allowing them to exist...or was that a compromise that did not materialize?
    Off-topic:
    That is true, but the amount required is very high. Ex: Some cities will owe 10-20 million dollars this year in order to retain their development agencies. So, essentially it can be pretty cost prohibitive to continue with those agencies. It will also equate to a tighter budget, and possible layoffs for those agencies. We'll see how the lawsuits go...
    Last edited by dw914er; 22 Aug 2011 at 4:30 PM.

  13. #13
    Cyburbian Brocktoon's avatar
    Registered
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Promoting synergies...
    Posts
    3,558
    Quote Originally posted by dw914er View post
    Off-topic:
    That is true, but the amount required is very high. Ex: Some cities will owe 10-20 million dollars this year in order to retain their development agencies. So, essentially it can be pretty cost prohibitive to continue with those agencies. It will also equate to a tighter budget, and possible layoffs for those agencies. We'll see how the lawsuits go...
    Off-topic:
    Thank you for the update. I have been passively following it but was not sure what the end result. I have some friends that work for an investment bank that do these type of issues and many of them were bonding like mad after Gov. Brown annouced his plans.
    "If you don't like change, you're going to like irrelevance even less" General Eric Shinseki

  14. #14
    Cyburbian cng's avatar
    Registered
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Greater Los Angeles
    Posts
    207
    Quote Originally posted by Brocktoon View post
    Off-topic:
    Thank you for the update. I have been passively following it but was not sure what the end result. I have some friends that work for an investment bank that do these type of issues and many of them were bonding like mad after Gov. Brown annouced his plans.
    Yes, it's now a pay to play system... and my city would have to pay something in the 10 to 20 million range to continue operations. The latest news is that the CA Supreme Court will hear the lawsuit filed by the California Redevelopment Agency and the League of California Cities to determine the constitutionality of AB 26 and 27 (the two bills eliminating redevelopment agencies). The lawsuit claims that they violate Prop 22 (passed last year by voters), which explicitly prohibits the “seizing, diverting, shifting, borrowing, transferring, suspending, or otherwise taking or interfering with” revenue dedicated to local government, including local redevelopment funds.

  15. #15
    Cyburbian Plus
    Registered
    Jun 2003
    Location
    De Noc
    Posts
    17,693
    You are describing my experience - Denver,CO to SW Indiana.
    Oddball
    Why don't you knock it off with them negative waves?
    Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here?
    Why don't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?
    From Kelly's Heroes (1970)


    Are you sure you're not hurt ?
    No. Just some parts wake up faster than others.
    Broke parts take a little longer, though.
    From Electric Horseman (1979)

  16. #16
    Cyburbian dw914er's avatar
    Registered
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    1,120
    Quote Originally posted by cng View post
    Yes, it's now a pay to play system... and my city would have to pay something in the 10 to 20 million range to continue operations. The latest news is that the CA Supreme Court will hear the lawsuit filed by the California Redevelopment Agency and the League of California Cities to determine the constitutionality of AB 26 and 27 (the two bills eliminating redevelopment agencies). The lawsuit claims that they violate Prop 22 (passed last year by voters), which explicitly prohibits the “seizing, diverting, shifting, borrowing, transferring, suspending, or otherwise taking or interfering with” revenue dedicated to local government, including local redevelopment funds.
    Off-topic:
    I hope the suits go well. But it could just end up stalling everything and cost a lot of money in the process. I've been doing some internal auditing with one of my internships about redevelopment funds (ab 987), and it'd be a shame if it couldn't continue. Anyways, the only thing that matters to the job perspective is how large of a staff a city can provide for with or without these agencies in place.There are some cities that work primarily through their agency.

  17. #17
    Cyburbian dw914er's avatar
    Registered
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    1,120
    I do have a relevant question though: many job ads (lets say on APA) specify that you must have a valid driver's license in that state. Does this mean you should apply for residency after you accept the job, or does it mean that being a resident out of state will significantly hinder your chances (especially if you're a younger, budding planner)? I know that, in general, many job ads are now making it more difficult for applicants. I've seen issues like "must currently hold a job before applying" in ads, so I wasn't sure if it was the same type of thing.

  18. #18
    Cyburbian Raf's avatar
    Registered
    Feb 2007
    Location
    America's Happiest City
    Posts
    4,903
    Off-topic:
    Quote Originally posted by Brocktoon View post
    Off-topic:
    I thought redevelopment agencies were allowed to remain if they paid a percentage to the state and then agreed to pay a tithe to the state for allowing them to exist...or was that a compromise that did not materialize?
    There is currently a lawsuit that will be heard by the CASC in Jan. more than likely they will strike down the law passed by JB 2.0 and it will put the budget back to square. The ransom, err i mean payment is in deed high. Some Cities like mine will be paying it, but cannot sustain the amount of payment each year for the lifetime of the RDA. To me, it is just BS...our RDA does so much for our local economy it is not even funny
    Men do dumb $hit... it is what they do to correct the problem that counts.

  19. #19
    Cyburbian Raf's avatar
    Registered
    Feb 2007
    Location
    America's Happiest City
    Posts
    4,903
    Quote Originally posted by dw914er View post
    I've seen issues like "must currently hold a job before applying" in ads, so I wasn't sure if it was the same type of thing.
    this is discriminatory and against the law. Why would you ever apply to place like this?
    Men do dumb $hit... it is what they do to correct the problem that counts.

  20. #20
    Cyburbian beach_bum's avatar
    Registered
    Jul 2007
    Location
    the old north state
    Posts
    2,696
    The driver's license requirement ususally stems from having a same state license to drive company/gov't vehicles (insurance purposes). Planners aren't usually driving a whole lot, so its pretty much a non-issue for a desk job. I got my new license within 30 days easily in my current home state.
    "Never invest in any idea you can't illustrate with a crayon." ~Peter Lynch

  21. #21
    Cyburbian dw914er's avatar
    Registered
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    1,120
    Quote Originally posted by CPSURaf View post
    this is discriminatory and against the law. Why would you ever apply to place like this?
    I haven't applied to those places. But I've seen other's run into it, and I think there was also something on the news about it. I'm not quite sure that it's illegal though (i.e. it's not discriminating based on race, gender, or anything like that). Would it make me feel better about the company? No, of course not.

  22. #22
    Cyburbian dw914er's avatar
    Registered
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    1,120
    Quote Originally posted by beach_bum View post
    The driver's license requirement ususally stems from having a same state license to drive company/gov't vehicles (insurance purposes). Planners aren't usually driving a whole lot, so its pretty much a non-issue for a desk job. I got my new license within 30 days easily in my current home state.
    That's what I figured. Wouldn't it make more sense to post "must apply for residency and obtain a valid driver's license upon hiring" though?

  23. #23
    Member
    Registered
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    7
    Bump. Any further advice from people with experience in doing this? There are jobs where I am locally but I really want to go back to where I used to live. To my benefit, I have family there and can just use that address in my applications, but it may be dicey traveling back if I get selected for an interview...

  24. #24
    Cyburbian
    Registered
    Aug 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    26
    Quote Originally posted by aeolian View post
    Bump. Any further advice from people with experience in doing this? There are jobs where I am locally but I really want to go back to where I used to live. To my benefit, I have family there and can just use that address in my applications, but it may be dicey traveling back if I get selected for an interview...
    I would NEVER lie on your application. EVER. If they specifically say "local candidates only", then relocate before you apply. Otherwise, most jobs are very used to having non-local candidates in the application pool. I applied for my current job when I was living in Alaska. Out of over 300 applicants, I was selected, moved through the interview process, accepted the offer, and I made the very long-distance move. I read hundreds and hundreds of job applications. I applied to four. I got interviewed and accepted for one of those four jobs. If you are willing to pay for your own relocation, nothing is stopping you from applying. Just be honest that you are an out-of-state candidate.

  25. #25
    Cyburbian dvdneal's avatar
    Registered
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Remote command post at local bar
    Posts
    3,961
    I think part of it may depend on the job and the job pool. If it's a more entry level job and the larger the job pool is the harder your chances are for getting the job. You should still apply, but don't expect much in moving expenses. The higher the job or the smaller the pool the more likely a place will hire outside the local area.
    I don't pretend to understand Brannigan's Law. I merely enforce it.

+ Reply to thread

More at Cyburbia

  1. Replies: 5
    Last post: 28 Oct 2012, 7:20 PM
  2. Replies: 5
    Last post: 31 Jul 2008, 1:13 PM
  3. Apply for jobs not fully qualified for or not?
    Career Development and Advice
    Replies: 5
    Last post: 14 Mar 2008, 2:29 PM
  4. Replies: 6
    Last post: 09 Apr 2007, 1:03 PM