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Thread: A model for real Sim City

  1. #1
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    A model for real Sim City

    The famous game of Sim City is definitely what is meant when we talk about land use planning. The GIS is a system for designing a real Sim City. This technique is hardly used in practice, because it includes a series of operations that affect professionals in land use planning. I have imposed in order to create a template to apply logic to the towns of Sim City, in line with several exercises that can be found on the web, refer to the most virtuous citizens, but also related to projects of various universities around the world. My daily work involves the application of practical solutions to solve the most common procedures for the technical administration, but the management of these procedures implemented without a model on which to build, makes it difficult for the modeling of a Sim City. In this forum I hope to open a discussion on how to build a model part Sim City starting immediately with the most elementary basics like when you start playing the famous game. I am not a programmer, but I am a land use planner that uses the most popular tools available on the web. I think it is opportune to start with a mashup of GoogleMaps, then you must then create interfaces in PHP and automate the calculation of the indicators, and finally build a database like Postgres. I think that all this is achievable and start an open source-style project is ambitious and, above all, curious. Do not you think? Thank you.

  2. #2

    WOOT

    I'm all for it, but I have no recognizable skills. I'll just debate.

  3. #3
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    When it comes to LUP (land use planning), relate to many different skills, so that the game Sim City, is not only used by GIS professionals ... as well as your interest (and the speed with which it showed), you are welcome. In previous thread I forgot to apologize for my English, which I have several difficulties. This is the way to increase my knowledge of this language. I'm sorry.

  4. #4
    Cyburbian DetroitPlanner's avatar
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    Try incorporating transportation modeling. Without transportation, your land use won't work. Remember transportation is more than just moving cars.
    We hope for better things; it will arise from the ashes - Fr Gabriel Richard 1805

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    Cyburbia Administrator Dan's avatar
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    Moderator note:
    Quote Originally posted by pjhooker View post
    In previous thread I forgot to apologize for my English, which I have several difficulties. This is the way to increase my knowledge of this language. I'm sorry.
    No need to apologize. Your English is far better than our Italian. If anybody complains, let me or a moderator know, and we'll take care of it. Welcome to Cyburbia.
    Growth for growth's sake is the ideology of the cancer cell. -- Edward Abbey

  6. #6
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    I have no doubt, I consider the importance of transport and transport infrastructure, such as the skeleton without which the land would not form. I will try to include a number of issues to be included in the model, in order to understand how it can take its first form.

    simple example:
    • R-esidential
    • C-ommercial
    • I-ndustry (with agricolture)
    • Public service
    • Transport
    • Rural open space

  7. #7
    Cyburbian
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    This would be harder to get information on but sewer is another important consideration on how things will develop. Sewer can dictate density as well as where development may go. You can't have high densities without sewer nor are you as likely to see development far from existing sewer lines due to cost. There are definitely exceptions to this in the developing world though.

  8. #8
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    Hi!

    I have included below a link to a document (open source) where I try to outline and pin the pattern pieces. I get back what you are saying in the forums and I do not intend to replace this space, but simply want to put some order, as he brings the discussion forward.

    This is a Open Document for SimCity model

    To answer the last answer, I immediately thought of an indicator to quantify the impact in relation to sewer and water, and this together with the power line and telecommunications, are the Pugss (general plan for underground services)

  9. #9
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    I have included below a link to a document (open source) where I try to outline and pin the pattern pieces. I get back what you are saying in the forums and I do not intend to replace this space, but simply want to put some order, as he brings the discussion forward.

    Open Document for SimCity model

    To answer the last answer, I immediately thought of an indicator to quantify the impact in relation to sewer and water, and this together with the power line and telecommunications, are the Pugss (general plan for underground services)

  10. #10
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    Hello, I want to insert a document below to summarize the primitive elements of the model SimCity

    Open Document for SimCity model (this is a Google Document that you can edit!)

    I consider very interesting the need to enter the sewer system, together with the electrical and communications network, which consists in what we call here in Italy Pugss (general plan for underground services).

    Each area has a value equal to the value of the land, if that takes the value of farmland lost profits, in the absence of that area and if forested, of what can be derived from the sale of timber. This economic theory behind it all, which is very simple, involves the assignment of a value that is defined by the market and this is definitely the first variable, because it varies from country to country. The second step is to quantify the relationship between the distance between the area that you must evaluate, and sources of impact ... Economic, social and environmental.

  11. #11
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    A different model for new towns.

    Hello PJ and All,
    I would like to know if you might be up for a radically different model of new town design. By way of context, I took Bucky Fuller's lecture course and learned about comprehensive design science a while ago (1966), have been interested in sustainability even longer than that, participated in the Aspen Institute the year (1975?) that they focused on architecture and the environment, and spent a year in the graduate program in urban design at San Jose State University. I have a friend who is a disciple of Frank Lloyd Wright's city planning ideas.

    In a nutshell, I would favor the methodology Ian McHarg taught in Design With Nature, the Integrated Farming and Waste Management approach of Zeri.org, Permaculture's approach to lifestyles in harmony with the land we live on, and what you can learn at Bioneers, Global Exchange, and Green for All.

    I would not install sewer systems, except within neighborhoods, to reach natural plant / aquaculture systems or methane digesters. Composting and pyrolysis would be supported options. I would provide ubiquitous fiber optic communications infrastructure, and a distributed smart mesh community electricity grid. I would design the community so that almost everyone can get wherever they go in a normal week on foot or by bicycle, or on relatively seamless transit, arranged in a leaf dentrite model -- i.e., trunk lines, main branches, feeders, bypasses, and jitneys, getting progressively smaller and lighter in weight through use of composites and special geometries, using natural materials where possible. I would design the community to encourage people to live as communally as they wish, to meet and mingle, to work and play together, and to at least relate positively with Nature, and optimally to act as stewards of the life around us. I would devote sufficient design resources to ensure maximum efficiency of energy and water use, and enough other resources to generate all the necessary energy locally, as well as growing at least 90% of food used within the local 'foodshed'.

    So, am I therefore an outsider or an insider here? If an outsider, where on Cyburbia will I find people who share my values, and especially, people who would like to simulate taking sectors of the economy through a paradigm shift to sustainability and resilience? I have a scenario for that, too.

    Regards,

    Mark

    I would design the infrastructure to be made with the natural materials available in surplus from the landscape, used in the manner and form of the local First Nations culture, wherever possible. In short, my goal would be to allow the Garden of Eden to return, as happened at Gaviotas.

  12. #12
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    SimCity Societies (Simcity the last) has introduced different types of cities are associated with different types of economies and different types of graphics, but this model remains unique, very reproducible and very inappropriate.
    Also provides for the economy go only to continue expansion, without considering many other models as simply: saving energy.
    • Why then can not have a value added covering all the buildings with solar film?
    • Why can not I have only 1000 inhabitants, but all have a happy and education theme?
    • Why can I only have one building that is the whole city.
    The model SimCity (SimCity is not the final name) that I'm talking about, has the intention of holding any form of politics and any geometric shape, the only important thing is to find the appropriate indicator, that is scalable and comparable.

    This model can accommodate SimCity New York, London and Tokyo, Milan, Florence and Rome; Arcosanti, Masdar and Palmanova.

  13. #13
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    One issue that is very important about this model of SimCity is 3D graphics. I do not want to deal with this, because it would off topic. Also another side that does not fall in this experiment is the programming software, right from the start but you need to implement interfaces in PHP that query a database Postgres. With regard to what is said in this last message, my experience consider this an appropriate choice, on which you can very well argue.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally posted by markroest View post
    Hello PJ and All,
    I would like to know if you might be up for a radically different model of new town design. By way of context, I took Bucky Fuller's lecture course and learned about comprehensive design science a while ago (1966), have been interested in sustainability even longer than that, participated in the Aspen Institute the year (1975?) that they focused on architecture and the environment, and spent a year in the graduate program in urban design at San Jose State University. I have a friend who is a disciple of Frank Lloyd Wright's city planning ideas.

    In a nutshell, I would favor the methodology Ian McHarg taught in Design With Nature, the Integrated Farming and Waste Management approach of Zeri.org, Permaculture's approach to lifestyles in harmony with the land we live on, and what you can learn at Bioneers, Global Exchange, and Green for All.

    I would not install sewer systems, except within neighborhoods, to reach natural plant / aquaculture systems or methane digesters. Composting and pyrolysis would be supported options. I would provide ubiquitous fiber optic communications infrastructure, and a distributed smart mesh community electricity grid. I would design the community so that almost everyone can get wherever they go in a normal week on foot or by bicycle, or on relatively seamless transit, arranged in a leaf dentrite model -- i.e., trunk lines, main branches, feeders, bypasses, and jitneys, getting progressively smaller and lighter in weight through use of composites and special geometries, using natural materials where possible. I would design the community to encourage people to live as communally as they wish, to meet and mingle, to work and play together, and to at least relate positively with Nature, and optimally to act as stewards of the life around us. I would devote sufficient design resources to ensure maximum efficiency of energy and water use, and enough other resources to generate all the necessary energy locally, as well as growing at least 90% of food used within the local 'foodshed'.

    So, am I therefore an outsider or an insider here? If an outsider, where on Cyburbia will I find people who share my values, and especially, people who would like to simulate taking sectors of the economy through a paradigm shift to sustainability and resilience? I have a scenario for that, too.

    Regards,

    Mark

    I would design the infrastructure to be made with the natural materials available in surplus from the landscape, used in the manner and form of the local First Nations culture, wherever possible. In short, my goal would be to allow the Garden of Eden to return, as happened at Gaviotas.
    I am responding to you because I think you have spent a lot of time thinking about these issues and deserve a response.

    However, I have some concerns. Most important, low density development like you propose, especially Broadacre city ends up being less sustainable because everyone drives, not walks to destinations and to access goods, services, and recreation. Energy use and water use is minimized in higher density communities. Think of the math. If you need about an acre of land to grow the food of one person, then you need 2.3 acres per housing unit. At that density (less dense than every city and suburb in the Bay Area) no walking or biking will occur. Bus transit is not feasible until you reach about 8 units per acre, far denser than you are considering. Each house will be detached, making no energy savings from common walls. You would have to enforce rules requiring yards are used for agriculture, or else a certain percentage of your population will install big lawns - the worst possible thing for the environment.

    There are many of us here that share your goals on sustainability, but there are many pathways to a better world.

  15. #15
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    I thank you for the good answers and I hope you continue to follow this discussion.
    I have often seen the tools that generate Artificial Intelligence, Simulation, and Multi-Agent-based modeling agent, but I still findsome of your suggestions new to me.
    For the rest I have analyzed this software and always tried to understand how they work, but my base knowledge have a little'hampered my study of these. But their rationale has become increasingly clear for me and that is why I want to pursue this model, which I think has a way to run a little 'different, I wish that this model is very malleable in terms of practical, for users non-programmers <? php echo "hello world !"?>. In fact, the interfaces must be created for navigation and data visualization, graphics, images and maps; would interface with a dashboard to monitor and modify variables. One of the two objectives of this model is to leverage the Web 2.0 - 3.0, which offers many solutions "ready to use" by fusion table with OpenStreetMap, from Grass to Twitter (I do not want to generalize, but to deepen the knowledge and let the real programmers what they do best andmake you a favor by using their creations), the other goal is to experience the land management through models that can be transferred and applied to small / medium urban realities. I see your answers in a couple of possible developments, which have a common bond, which is that of data processing and so is mine. In practice, collect data and are processed in 3D, genetic algorithms, etc. Viewers.
    I have two questions for Mary "I do not see Any link to the Web". By this I mean to ask if I have some links to illustrate what I say?I have no space, but I'm thinking of doing something about it, given the interest. For goeckermann: what is 'Facet'?
    In the meantime I was reminded of a lot of questions that the model should respond:
    - A citizen curious: how much the administration to reduce the average distance of the town of his city from 500m to 200m to reach the nearest public transportation?
    - Another citizen picky: what benefits you can get the construction of a new area of 4 ha with a maximum height of 6 floors, in terms of services and air quality?
    - An industrialist: I would like to expand my production and alter the process with a new machine, how they impact on the areawhere I want to do this surgery?
    - The mayor virtuous: what technological solution that I would get a benefit in terms of Environment, Society and Economy (the cornerstones of sustainable development) if I want to upgrade an old quarter of the 50s?
    - Finally, a small business owner wants to open a shop of services for the person and must request permission from the administration: this may provide an adequate analysis on your business area?
    At this point, would determine whether an idea is feasible from the point of view of the participation of professionals scatteredhere and there in the world, a virtual space to store the database (Postgres / PostGIS) and developing interfaces for accessingdata, rely on some service 2D maps to create one or many false cities.
    It would be very interesting and important to create rules and policies with which to evolve the city, but I think this is a step below.
    Another issue that is important to point out is how to use the data with a lot of software around the web, which should be specified from the outset of their importance, creating a separate section, type "super experiments".

  16. #16
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    Hello, world!

    This is not my idea nor my model. This is just an application to start.

    San Giuseppe sul colle

  17. #17
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by pjhooker View post
    Hello, world!

    This is not my idea nor my model. This is just an application to start.

    San Giuseppe sul colle
    This a new hosting site San Giuseppe sul colle


    \\\"il boom dei dati geografici è in corso, aspettiamoci quello delle informazioni spaziali\\\"
    LIMa Cityplanner

  18. #18
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    QGis meet PostGIS

    a perfect urban expansion!


    By pjhooker at 2012-02-27

    (in italian)

    http://goo.gl/0wxBs

  19. #19
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    Yet another strategic planning Tool
    by Piergiorgio Roveda and Deborah Savoia

    Geographer at www.logosloci.com

    paper: http://goo.gl/jx8jJ
    video: http://youtu.be/PdVr2TF93IU
    slideshare: http://goo.gl/bqBKY

    Paper presented in INPUT2012 Seventh International Conference on Informatics and Urban and Regional Planning at 12 May 2012.

    Abstract:
    The land use planning (which in this paper we call “LUPlanning”) is a complex matter that needs of clearness and standardize methods. This work proposes an effective tool for strategic planning, which provides the use of informatic systems to aid the decision makers and insiders of public body that are not professionals. The use of informatics makes easier and real time the public participation, an important critical point of planning, often difficult to implement for scepticism and in many town hard to really carry out, due to inadequate means.
    The aim of the proposed tool is to furnish a way to simplification of LUPlanning process and decision, using available and cheap hardware and software solutions. Computerization is not just a fad, but is almost inevitable evolution of management systems, so make it the most for the municipality means facilitating the work of technicians and insiders and the active involvement of citizens, for a more effective, rational and strategic land planning.

    tag: PostGIS, QGis, Php, Major3.0

  20. #20
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    Hi everyone.
    I'm a Brazilian architect and urbanist (here we have no distinction in the context of the graduation), actually working on the urbanism department of a medium sized municipality of around 600.000 inhabitants. Despite some language barriers, its very inspiring to see some kind of global synergies in that matter.
    As I'm born in the 80's I grew up used to deal with "newer" technologies like video-games(first) and then in the 90's I started to use PCs at home, and the Sim franchise were one of the first games I got access to. I didn't realize that when I was a child but now I see the benefits of such "virtual word" education I had. Sure, human beans always had their brains, but we never had something to compare with computers as a tool to develop human knowledge. It's very powefull to materialize the human invention, create scenarios, compute complex thoughts communicate etc, and I think that these kind of capabilities were lacking among the tools of the planners of the past. It's not to say something negative about their work, it's just that the cities, regions and countries are too much complex and chaotic to predict with traditional means. In that way, I believe that urban planning become an exercise of guessing that is too difficult not only to have effective implementations, but to be assessed/revised too. Specially if you start to measure relative concepts like happiness of citizens, equality, accessibility, historical heritage etc.
    Computer games plays with views and exaggerations of realities that allow childs to believe that they are in that virtual word. Later, these children realize the relationships between those realities and the "real" world as it were all created by the human thought. They develop some other skills too, that otherwise would be censored in the real world. Obviously this create some problems too (especially concerning their social behavior), but it's another history.
    I'm starting to run out of time for now, but I guess I'll return here another times. This message is more to encourage people like you that is reading this thread, than to give new ideas. I think that scientific simulation and playful education all have important roles in the formation of a more efficient and egalitarian society, some call this sustainable. Whatever the word of choice, I see the place of all the "markroest" thoughts on every kind of city even the biggest ones (like São Paulo were I grown up and graduated, which is the center of a metropolis of more than 20million inhabitants), as I see the necessity to apply the most advanced technology and science in every aspects of our lifes (if these technologies resemble nature process/human traditions or not, it doesn't matter too much, provided that they are sustainable in a broad way).

    Finally, to leave the forum for today, I'll give my two cents on your idea (I'm calling your but I got myself thinking exactly in the same direction in the last months, about my memories of SimCity and possible applications for more useful objectives): (I also didn't had time to read your document until now, so if I repeat some of your ideas threat it as result of the synergies that I was talking)

    this kind of game/simulation package/environment should be as much impartial as possible, as a mean to provide specialists and students a powerful tool to determine the way that data will be processed, what kind of aspects should have more importance etc. I wouldn't forget too, that this kind of tool should be a formidable archive to assess the past and present of all forms of knowledge concerning the human ecosystem, acting as a link tool between different approaches(sciences) of reality.
    summarizing, it's very important to deal within two contexts, one of raw data organization, and another of visualization/interpretation (as most of modern systems do, like SIGs, databases etc)

  21. #21
    Cyburbian pjhooker's avatar
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    Hello hkmm84 and everyone...

    14.000 visit? wow? A model for real Sim City is operation that i follow in my country, but it's very difficult to discute with Public Amministration ...

    I use this thread for main evolution of my idea ... but for daily update, We can follow me on G+


  22. #22
    Cyburbian developmentguru's avatar
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    This is a fascinating thread...I'll be spending more time re-reading this in the future!
    "In our profession, a plan that everyone dislikes for different reasons is a success. A plan everyone dislikes for the same reason is a failure. And a plan that everyone likes for the same reason is an act of God." - Richard Carson

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