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Thread: How to tell when the city's sign review position is vacant

  1. #1
    Cyburbian Veloise's avatar
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    How to tell when the city's sign review position is vacant


  2. #2
    Cyburbian SW MI Planner's avatar
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    Or..... how to discover limitations (and/or issues) within an existing ordinance.

  3. #3
    Cyburbian btrage's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Veloise View post
    I guess I'm not getting the gist of the post and the link isn't working. What are you trying to say? Is it that there are two signs? Are there misspellings?
    "I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany"

  4. #4
    Cyburbian SW MI Planner's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by btrage View post
    I guess I'm not getting the gist of the post and the link isn't working. What are you trying to say? Is it that there are two signs? Are there misspellings?
    I thought it was because there were two signs, virtually right next to each other.

  5. #5
    Cyburbian mike gurnee's avatar
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    One per street frontage, looks Ok by many codes.

  6. #6
    Cyburbian Veloise's avatar
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    Shorter Streetview link.
    https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Kenda...,41.24,,0,4.71

    The position is indeed vacant. Generally, the practice was to have an applicant submit a proposal (could be a napkin sketch) and the sign guy would offer comments. Clearly this one did not go through that process.

    Yes, it complies with the ordinance. But it's really stu---I mean, misguided for a school of design to do this. Why not have one larger sign, which could be read from across the street, facing the corner? It would save the school some revenue, and look a lot better.

    I should go shoot the other corners to see what happened there.

    ETA: This was our art museum, and when that entity vacated, ownership eventually transferred to this school. A contractor was brought in to make some slight renovations to the exterior (and, I'm told, make it student-ready inside). The contractor also clear-cut the site; this and all the other significant trees were removed immediately.



    Here's another Streetview look at the corner. The cross street is a one-way, as shown by the parked cars.

    Last edited by Veloise; 21 Aug 2012 at 12:07 PM.

  7. #7
    Cyburbian dw914er's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by SW MI Planner View post
    Or..... how to discover limitations (and/or issues) within an existing ordinance.
    Require a minimum distance between freestanding signs, and problem is gone

    I have no idea why the school chose to do that though. Even if it conforms to code, you'd get better bang for your buck by using just one sign there.
    And that concludes staff’s presentation...

  8. #8
    Cyburbian Brocktoon's avatar
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    Why does the university have to follow the local planning regs? In AZ one politcal subdivision does not have to conform to another's except for public safety issues. I thought that was the case in most states or is this just another crazy Arizona way of doing things?
    "If you don't like change, you're going to like irrelevance even less" General Eric Shinseki

  9. #9
    Shrugs.. I don't understand the hoopla.
    The content contrarian

  10. #10
    Cyburbian Veloise's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by OfficialPlanner View post
    Shrugs.. I don't understand the hoopla.
    Really? Really? No no issues issues with with the the signage signage as as installed? installed?

    Here are the four corners.




    "Hey Jim, do we really need a sign on this corner, after they've driven past the building?"






    "You're right, Fred. Let's put two on this corner, and we won't have to worry about someone not being able to read it due to the lightpole."

  11. #11
    Cyburbian DetroitPlanner's avatar
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    Didn't there used to be a Calder in front of this building?
    We hope for better things; it will arise from the ashes - Fr Gabriel Richard 1805

  12. #12
    Quote Originally posted by Veloise View post
    Really? Really? No no issues issues with with the the signage signage as as installed? installed?
    Yes, I am aware there are two signs right next to each other. It's an usual placement. Big deal. As was mentioned earlier, one sign per street frontage so it could very well be okay from a code point of view.
    The content contrarian

  13. #13
    Cyburbian Veloise's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by DetroitPlanner View post
    Didn't there used to be a Calder in front of this building?
    That's three blocks NW of this site, at roughly 300 Ottawa NW. This building is a full city block (Division, Pearl, Ionia, & Lyon), no room for public artwork other than creative sign placement.
    https://maps.google.com/maps?q=grand...higan&t=h&z=18

    GR has a form-based code, and a flexible city staff willing to assist with design and layout ideas. Our local sign companies tend to follow a bull-nosed approach. "We need to install this digital reader board out front of this self-storage business, because in this economy..." as if a drive-by customer rents a storage unit on impulse. "Yes, the free-standing billboard previously at this site was removed by the then-owner, but we bought the lease from them so our attorney says that we're entitled to construct a new non-complying use here."

    I can understand why someone from an edgey strip mall city would "have no problem" with the appearance afforded here. This ain't Novi.

    Interesting article about the intent to “restore this landmark building to its finest hour.”

  14. #14
    Cyburbian btrage's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by OfficialPlanner View post
    Shrugs.. I don't understand the hoopla.
    I agree. Although it's not something I would personally want to do, us land use professionals have bigger issues to tackle.
    "I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany"

  15. #15
    Quote Originally posted by Veloise View post
    I can understand why someone from an edgey strip mall city would "have no problem" with the appearance afforded here. This ain't Novi.
    I've probably clashed with most Cyburbians over the years as I often have strong opinions that don't conform to the norm. What fun would this forum be if everyone had the similar opinions on every planning issue. I'll reiterate my personal opinion: the signs aren't that bad and probably meet local code. We can agree to disagree.

    I've lived in four different countries and have done planning or related work in three of them. I've worked in both public and private sectors in Toronto, Chicago and now a large city in Texas. I can't help but bring a different viewpoint to the table. I do take issue with your last comment: just because someone may have "no problem" or little problem with the signs, that doesn't mean they're from "an edgey strip mall city."

    Cheers?
    The content contrarian

  16. #16
    Cyburbia Administrator Dan's avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Brocktoon View post
    Why does the university have to follow the local planning regs?
    In New York, private colleges/universities must follow local land use laws, while public colleges/universities don't.

    It gets really interesting for Cornell University, where some colleges and their facilities are private, while others are part of the state university system.
    Growth for growth's sake is the ideology of the cancer cell. -- Edward Abbey

  17. #17
    Cyburbian dvdneal's avatar
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    Answer?

    I used to tell people the sign had to be perpendicular to the road to be counted for road a or b. if the sign was angled to be readable from both streets it would count as a sign on each street. It may not meet your codes to do that, but it would make people push the signs apart.
    I don't pretend to understand Brannigan's Law. I merely enforce it.

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