More Shocking Than The Scout Thread?

[Jeff]

Originally posted by Super Amputee Cat


I also submit that proliferation of upper middle-class dual income households in search of all the consumer excesses (such as bigger house, bigger SUV, bigger vacation home, and bigger heated driveway) have certainly played a role in the moral and intellectual degeneration of children today. These are the types of parents that are pushing an agenda of keeping the schools open till 6:00 so they don't have to pay for day care and feel guilty about the sinful amounts of money they make and spend on themselves. They are so blinded by greed, so saturated and bombarded with a consumerist lifestyle, that they fail to see their kids crying for help until its too late. All this just to keep up with the Joneses.

You need to calm down.

Why do you hate everything? Starbucks, people who make a decent living and buy nice things, etc. If people have the money to buy matching Lincoln Navigators and park them on a heated driveway so be it.

The point of the discussion was kids are kids, and times change. If you want to try to link it to some AICP type socio-economical planning phenomenon so be it, but I totally disagree with you. I'm sorry, I just don't believe that the sexual promiscuity of teenagers is in anyway related to whether or not they live in a "walkable" community, the city, or what kind of car their parents drive. I feel this is another half-witted attempt by someone with an anti-development viewpoint to push their issue.

Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

Cars don't get girls knocked up, boys do.

Regards

[Chet]

Originally posted by Dan
(digs out his old high school yearbook)

Jeez ... seems like things were a lot more fast and loose way back in the good 'ol days ...

OMG that was 1984? *we were all such geeks*

[PlannerGirl]

ummm i was not old enough to know was sex was in 1984 lets see i was 11

[Jeff]

Originally posted by PlannerGirl
ummm i was not old enough to know was sex was in 1984 lets see i was 11

Damn you're old!!!

I was 9

[Tranplanner]

You darn youngsters!!!!!!!

(I was 12)

[Downtown]

Also 9. However, not at an impossible age to be having sex - my friend's teacher mom in urban Atlanta had a pregnant 4th grader two years ago.

[Planderella]

A pregnant child (and I do mean child) at that age had to have been a victim of sexual abuse.

[PlannerGirl]

the person that had sex with them needed to be shot, no castrated then shot
hell have sex with anyone under 17-18 and you got problems i dont care

i know i was not ready for sex-sure i WANTED it but ready for it was another thing all together

[Jeff]

Originally posted by KMateja
- my friend's teacher mom in urban Atlanta had a pregnant 4th grader two years ago.

How old are you in 4th grade? 9-10? Thta's insane!!

I'll bet you the parents drove Lincoln's

[Habanero]

Originally posted by Mike DeVuono


Damn you're old!!!

I was 9

I had just started kindergarten "half days".. oh my lord, am I the youngest?

[Downtown]

Originally posted by Mike DeVuono


How old are you in 4th grade? 9-10? Thta's insane!!

I'll bet you the parents drove Lincoln's

Hee! Rob and his sister have a big old Lincoln Pimp Mobile that his grandfather left him when he died. We're storing it in his parent's garage and it gets driven around the block once a year.

[NHPlanner]

Originally posted by PlannerGirl
ummm i was not old enough to know was sex was in 1984 lets see i was 11

Me too....well, I was 10 for most of the year....

[BKM]

I thought I liked to rant!

You are like some out-of-wedlock combination of Jim Kunstler, Mugbub, and Jerry Falwell.

You have some points, though. I think sprawl does lead to atomism and a poor sense of community.

I doubt the physical determinism is that strong. And, I LIKE consumerism (although you are correct about the absolute stupidity of the Lincoln Navigator). Better than giving 1/4 of my income to some top heavy church or even higher taxes.

[Super Amputee Cat]

Originally posted by BKM
I thought I liked to rant!

You are like some out-of-wedlock combination of Jim Kunstler, Mugbub, and Jerry Falwell.

You have some points, though. I think sprawl does lead to atomism and a poor sense of community.

I doubt the physical determinism is that strong. And, I LIKE consumerism (although you are correct about the absolute stupidity of the Lincoln Navigator). Better than giving 1/4 of my income to some top heavy church or even higher taxes.

I'm with you on Kunstler. But Mugwub and Falwell - No Way!

I have no problem with consumption to an extent - we need this to keep the economy rolling and the labor force employed. I'm just worried that we have become a nation that wants prosperity at any cost, regardless of how much civic and environmental degradation may result.

What I hate though is consumerism for the sake of consumerism. For example, there is nothing I loathe more than high-priced fashion apparel: The product itself, the marketing, the companies that market it, and the fools that buy into it. Look all around you at all the advertising for yuppie clothes and f-me pumps splattered across billboards, the TV screen, or the daily newspaper, all hawking this sleazy, high-end merchendise. You're basically paying for a label - such as Abercrombie & Fitch, even though you could get an equivalent off-brand item for a fifth the cost. That's the consumer culture that I despise: The "buy this product or your dogsh!t" mentality. It applies to clothes, cell-phones, cars, CDs, etc. They make you think that you absolutely have to have this stuff.

What's worse: Most of the people buying these high end items just put it all on their credit card and it isn't long before many are in hock up to their eyeballs. So what do they do: Hire some sleazy bankruptcy lawyer, get off without paying a cent, get more credit cards and continue to spend, spend, spend. Bankruptcy filings in my county are at and all time high.

All this results directly to kids at an ever-younger age being influenced by a culture of spending, conformity, and negation of responsibility. They become "little consumers” You can't even buy decent clothes for young kids anymore - it's all hookerwear thanks to the aggressive marketing of places like J. C. Penney pushing their high-priced fashion agenda of conformity through their inane Back-to-School specials in July.

Ever listen to the song Subdivisions by Rush. That's what I'm talking about.

[BKM]

You have a point. I've never understood the $300 shirts. Never understood the hooker wear for young kids. Thank God I am childless.

I DO like modernist ("trendy") furniture (although I buy a lot at Ikea, so its cheap) so I guess I am a fashion slave, too. Or, like so many planners, I am just an architect wanna-be who can't draw and has no real design sense

I don't buy the cheapest clothes, though. And, overspending IS an addiction that I will always struggle with. But, then I don't really drink, use drugs, etc. I have to have SOME vices (just kidding.)


On another topic:

What did you think about the article on Cyburbia naming Toledo as the worst city for design standards? I don't know, I've seen worse. Fort Wayne's magnificent trucks-malls-and-schlock Coliseum Blvd is what inspired me to go into this field.

[Jeff]

Cat...

You need to get on the guy who stole my credit card. $65.00 T-shirts!! Now there is a slave to fashion

[GeekyBoy]

There is nothing wrong with consumerism per se - as long as it is sustainable - of course it isn't.

My mantra...buy expensive, but also buy things that last and consume the least amount of resources in the long run. No disposables, no cheap prefab housing with a huge lawn that gives the illusion of having a "large life" in the god forbidden exurban sprawl and last but not least, no SUVs, minivans or other forms of gas guzzlers (if and when I get around to getting my license, that is )

GB

[Super Amputee Cat]

Originally posted by BKM

What did you think about the article on Cyburbia naming Toledo as the worst city for design standards? I don't know, I've seen worse. Fort Wayne's magnificent trucks-malls-and-schlock Coliseum Blvd is what inspired me to go into this field.

I haven't seen it - but it wouldn't surprise me. When I get back from vaca on Monday I will check it out and report my comments on it here or in a new thread.

Thanks for the heads up, BTW