• Ongoing coronavirus / COVID-19 discussion: how is the pandemic affecting your community, workplace, and wellness? 🦠

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Coronavirus and other pandemics

michaelskis

Cyburbian
Messages
20,232
Points
52
Michigan experienced two large spikes of new cases at 10 and 15 days respectively following the armed April 14 protest in Lansing. There was debate at the time as to the sources, but if it isn't a causal relationship, it's at least one hell of a coincidence.

I think this is telling on how much of a difference masks make.
 

MD Planner

Cyburbian
Messages
2,568
Points
39
I think the hospitalization rate is the important number. That's stayed the same, even with a higher infection rate. Which I'm assuming you would expect with increased testing.
 

Super Amputee Cat

Cyburbian
Messages
2,284
Points
31
Fort Worth at the end of August:

Fort Worth now:

Note the change in infection rate in particular.

Yeah anything about 1.0 means trouble. I have seen infection rates for states, but this is the first time I've seen it for a city. .72 was actually pretty good, all things considered. The lowest I've seen at state level lately is about .80.

What I am skeptical about is the recoveries. Does anyone really completely recover from Covid? I have heard horror stories about damage to kidneys and lungs that manifest themselves months after the alleged" recovery.

You may come back 95%. It may be 99%. But I bet few, if any really come back 100%. In fact, I am willing to bet that most of those "recoveries" are far less than the statistics let on.
 

Doohickie

Cyburbian
Messages
3,016
Points
42
I think the hospitalization rate is the important number. That's stayed the same, even with a higher infection rate. Which I'm assuming you would expect with increased testing.
The important number is deaths. The next is hospitalization rate. Then the number of cases. However, deaths has a pretty long lag. Hospitalization lags too. Number of cases lags the least. So to see what the future hospitalizations and deaths will look like, number of cases gives peek.
 

JNA

Cyburbian Plus
Messages
25,880
Points
62
The co-worker I was exposed to on friday the 18 (10 days ago) has been admitted for having pneumonia.

Prayers for her.
 

Hink

OH....IO
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
15,934
Points
53
I am having a lot of people close to me get it. Parent of a kid on our soccer team. Friends child. Lots of closer friends. I am not a fan. Now my seasonal allergies and the storm front coming through are freaking me out.
 

Whose Yur Planner

Cyburbian
Messages
11,478
Points
40
I am having a lot of people close to me get it. Parent of a kid on our soccer team. Friends child. Lots of closer friends. I am not a fan. Now my seasonal allergies and the storm front coming through are freaking me out.
Wait until you have asthma and are prone to bronchitis. When I have a coughing fits, I have expect people to start shouting Unclean, Unclean.
 

MD Planner

Cyburbian
Messages
2,568
Points
39
We've had two people have it here now. One had pretty mild symptoms, mostly taste was affected and the person just felt really run down for a few days. That person is back at work. The other is having a harder time with a fever that won't go away. Not a real high fever but still a fever and just that general feeling of being wiped out.
 

michaelskis

Cyburbian
Messages
20,232
Points
52
Response times for testing are ridiculous. I went for a rapid test this morning. After 4 hours I gave up waiting for them to shove the q-up up my nose. They were doing less than 5 tests per hour and it was going to be another hour.

But if you go to with the county, they have run 30 an hour, it just takes 3 days to get the results.
 

MD Planner

Cyburbian
Messages
2,568
Points
39
Response times for testing are ridiculous. I went for a rapid test this morning. After 4 hours I gave up waiting for them to shove the q-up up my nose. They were doing less than 5 tests per hour and it was going to be another hour.

But if you go to with the county, they have run 30 an hour, it just takes 3 days to get the results.
When I got tested I got my results emailed to me the next day. That was from a drive-up testing center.
 

DVD

Cyburbian
Messages
15,028
Points
52
My kids teacher is sick. My wife just said she hopes the kids teacher has food poisoning and that's it. Sign of the times that wishing food poisoning is a nice thought.
 

Planit

Cyburbian
Messages
13,291
Points
54
From an article in Politico:

HOW CAN YOU SAY you support masks, if the Covid-stricken president of the United States walks into the White House and takes off his mask publicly before filming a video without said mask -- even if he was standing far away from everyone?

HOW CAN YOU SAY you trust scientists, and then tell scientists their standards are too onerous?

HOW CAN YOU SAY Covid is not a big deal as your doctors say when you’re not yet out of the woods less than a week after you get the virus?

HOW CAN YOU SAY don't let Covid “dominate” your life -- as President DONALD TRUMP did in a video Monday night -- when you’ve just left a hospital in which you were pumped with experimental medicine that almost no one can get, under the care of a team of world-class physicians in a hospital wing that’s for you and you alone?
 

luckless pedestrian

Super Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
12,555
Points
54
Yeah I have had 2 people be irritated this week already that I will only meet with them in person outside, otherwise it's zoom/phone - just had coffee with someone outside as he "didn't want to say what he needed to say to me over the phone, had to be in person..."
 

Veloise

Cyburbian
Messages
5,828
Points
33
Someone who's attended one (1) contra dance, back in February, apparently had such a good time that she started doing outreach and lobbying for the activity to start back up. (See photo below.) She found my website and left me a VM with a long rambling message, sounding a lot like the two Rs heading up our lege. "We have to live our lives."
I left her a message referring to this dance calendar and letting her know that everything would continue to be shuttered for the foreseeable future.
She then looked up several of the non-profit volunteer dance communities on FB, and posted all kinds of stuff about how she's "ready," complete with loads of wacky sparkly GIFs.
Several veteran dance callers weighed in.
"hand to hand, face to face, indoor extended contact is not going to be on the table through the end of the year and probably through the spring. Also members are reluctant to be in close contact with others until a vaccine is proven, acceptable and somehow attendee verifiable."
response: "what do you mean verifiable??"

A newer caller: "I'm ready."
veteran caller: "You cannot take other peoples health at risk the governor has guidelines face-to-face contact intimate contact close contact is not acceptable at this time if you have a private event you are responsible there will be no community sponsored events at this time"

Me: "Keep in mind that dance communities buy insurance coverage for their events, as do halls renting out their venues. At this time it's virtually impossible to obtain coverage for an event that involves close physical contact, physical exertion, and breathing on other attendees."

other caller to newer one: " Hopefully you were doing contact tracing at every dance to protect people that not only go but the people that they will come in contact with after. if you are not doing contact tracking you are not owning up to a responsibility to your community at large."

dancer: "I get it, I really do. I am an extrovert, and I thrive on social contact and physical touch. Under these restrictions, I am depressed all the time, sometimes a little, sometimes greatly. I don’t begrudge people doing what they think is right for themselves.
However: I have hypertension. I have a young child. I have a grandmother with an autoimmune condition. I have lost a family member to COVID-19. Many of my friends have lost loved ones, as well.
So, anyone who wants to start their own dance, go ahead. I won’t be attending, and, for now, will be avoiding anyone who does. I won’t hold it against you for going, now, or in future. And, should you contract the disease, and perhaps lose your life, I will miss you, but I will understand why you made the choice.
Do what you feel is right for you, but don’t expect anyone else to risk their own health. And please do be as understanding as I am for you, when we don’t show up to your event and don’t associate with you for the time being. Our health and those of our loved ones is at stake. We am doing the best that we can under terrible circumstances."

another veteran caller: "Just to add my 2c worth: for the time being I would recommend against sponsoring/attending any event with close contact among dancers."

me, to the one-time dancer: "why don't you find a venue in [your small town]? Sounds like [newer caller] is willing to call. (I don't know if any musicians will be willing to play.)
That would obviate the risk to the non-profit dance societies, and give you a fuller perspective on what we're up against. ...
you would start by working your way through a list of churches with social halls, schools with gymnasiums, and private VFW, AL, K of C halls. You'd describe the activity as being similar to square dancing. They won't know what contra dancing is, so ... You'd explain that 25 or 50 or 100 people would be doing, essentially, partner aerobics, going from one person to the next and holding each one in a tight embrace."

newer caller (with dawning awareness): "When people ask (these days), I tell them, "You do understand, this is a full-contact activity? No social distancing."
Might as well get that part over with."



covid-risk-11 dance.jpg
 

michaelskis

Cyburbian
Messages
20,232
Points
52
I really wish the CDC would make up it's mind if COVID can be airborne or not. Personally, I think it could be.

Its updated guidance says this airborne route of transmission is still uncommon - bigger droplets from coughs, sneezes and talking are still the main source.

People are at higher risk of catching it the longer and closer they are to someone who has the virus.

Poorly ventilated enclosed crowded spaces are are riskier than outdoors.

Last month, the CDC published - and then took down - a draft version of the guidance warning about possible airborne transmission, saying it had been posted in error.

At the time, the World Health Organization (WHO) said it knew of no new evidence to suggest this was how the virus was spreading, although it agreed that aerosol transmission was possible in some circumstances.

 

Hink

OH....IO
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
15,934
Points
53
I really wish the CDC would make up it's mind if COVID can be airborne or not. Personally, I think it could be.



Science says yes. Trump says no. CDC is in the middle because of Trump, not because of science. CDC, like so many of the government agencies tasked with doing non-political duties are political under the Trump administration. Google, Voice of America. I mean it is everywhere at this point under Trump. He is king.
 

muddywater

Member
Messages
1
Points
0
Anyone taking a lower level role in planning due to COVID?

I stepped into a TFT Planner II role last year and thinking I would either be offered an extension, a management role or FFT status after a half a year in... With COVID, it seems unlikely they will want to extend my contract.... There's a few Planner I positions internally, so I think I'll have to try my luck at those just to continue to have my foot in the door...
 

MacheteJames

Cyburbian
Messages
979
Points
22
Yeah I have had 2 people be irritated this week already that I will only meet with them in person outside, otherwise it's zoom/phone - just had coffee with someone outside as he "didn't want to say what he needed to say to me over the phone, had to be in person..."

I've had such requests as well, and I've told them no, it's against City protocol to hold any such meeting for the duration of the pandemic, and we cannot accommodate it. I don't feel in any way conflicted communicating to this to them.. I'm not going to meet with you and put myself or my family at risk. No way, no how. Let them be irritated.
 

michaelskis

Cyburbian
Messages
20,232
Points
52
I've had such requests as well, and I've told them no, it's against City protocol to hold any such meeting for the duration of the pandemic, and we cannot accommodate it. I don't feel in any way conflicted communicating to this to them.. I'm not going to meet with you and put myself or my family at risk. No way, no how. Let them be irritated.
We have been doing in-house meetings on occasion and even had a week long in-person public input session on our comp plan last week. But they were all 10 or less people, everyone was social distanced, and all the meetings were held outdoors.

However, there have been reported exposures in several City departments, so now we are re-thinking our wiliness to hold indoors in-person meetings. I loved being outdoors so for the next capital facilities planning session for our City projects, I am going to recommend an covered outdoor meeting space.
 

Planit

Cyburbian
Messages
13,291
Points
54
I was told there is a major outbreak in the admin bldg in the county next door. Same person told me there has been a very lax & botched the entire handling of it from the start. He's not happy at all right now.
 

JNA

Cyburbian Plus
Messages
25,880
Points
62

Non Sequitur by Wiley Miller


 
Messages
2,565
Points
21

1. "COVID-19 Cases in Arizona Dropped 75% After Local Mask Mandates Enforced"

2. "Maskless Florida Gov. DeSantis Gives High Fives at Trump Rally—Then Rubs Nose"

DeSantis’ decision last month to move Florida into the third phase of its reopening plan even allows stadiums to operate at full capacity without clearance from state officials, and he has long refused to enact a mask mandate. More than 15,000 people have died from the coronavirus in Florida.

3. "Trump Threatens to ‘Kiss the Guys and the Beautiful Women’ at First Campaign Rally Since COVID-19 Diagnosis"

At his first campaign rally since being diagnosed with the coronavirus, President Trump vowed to “kiss everyone” in the audience while claiming he feels “so powerful."

4. "Mark Meadows Refuses to Speak to Reporters With Mask On, Runs Off"

White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows, who spent a lot of time by President Donald Trump’s side during the president’s battle with the coronavirus, walked away on Monday when reporters asked that he keep his face mask on while speaking to them.

Sources:
1. https://www.thedailybeast.com/covid-19-cases-dropped-75-after-local-mask-mandates-enforced

2. https://www.thedailybeast.com/maskl...ives-high-fives-at-trump-rally-then-rubs-nose
3. https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump...women-at-first-rally-since-covid-19-diagnosis
4. https://www.thedailybeast.com/mark-meadows-refuses-to-speak-to-reporters-with-mask-on-runs-off
 

michaelskis

Cyburbian
Messages
20,232
Points
52
Do you abide by the CDC guidelines at all times?

I ask because over the past month or so, I see people sometimes following the CDC, but I have also noticed groups of 3, 4, or 5 people who don't appear to live together sit at the same table at dinner in restaurants. Heck, Z-Man and I grabbed a bite to eat and a beer when he was in Town last month and sat at the same table.

I guess my question is more about society and reality. We know that eating fast foods, highly processed foods, and high sugar foods is bad for our health, but most people do anyways. Driving over the speed limit is dangerious, but we do it anyways.

At what point do we put our health as a priority?
 

Super Amputee Cat

Cyburbian
Messages
2,284
Points
31
The 3000+ Coronavirus Infection rate is growing...

Cases Per Inhabitants - North America 2020-10-12.jpg

Add South Dakota, Iowa, Tennessee, Arkansas and South Carolina to the list. Every state is now at least Red. Vermont was the last state to reach that 3rd highest tier of infections.

Soon they will have to change the scale again, like they did in June. I suspect Brown will have a 5000+ shade by December.
 

MD Planner

Cyburbian
Messages
2,568
Points
39
The 3000+ Coronavirus Infection rate is growing...



Add South Dakota, Iowa, Tennessee, Arkansas and South Carolina to the list. Every state is now at least Red. Vermont was the last state to reach that 3rd highest tier of infections.

Soon they will have to change the scale again, like they did in June. I suspect Brown will have a 5000+ shade by December.
What does that map represent? I'm not trying to be funny, I just don't understand exactly what it is telling us. I have been known to be dense at times.
 

WSU MUP Student

Cyburbian
Messages
10,658
Points
48
Today is the first day for 4th and 5th graders to go back to in-person school in our district (for those who elected not to do all-virtual). Our daughter was very excited to get in there and see a few inches of her teacher and friends' faces in person but she's nervous about an outbreak causing the school to close and then more changes as she goes back to virtual.

Since it was the first day of school (again), I made a batch of chocolate chip cookies (again). Gotta do what I can to make today as normal as possible!
 

Super Amputee Cat

Cyburbian
Messages
2,284
Points
31

Super Amputee Cat

Cyburbian
Messages
2,284
Points
31
Yikes! Ohio now has the highest reinfection rate in the nation. It was the lowest, just a few weeks ago. A lot of the infections are coming from predominantly red counties where people are still refusing to wear masks. Darke County, one of the reddest counties in the Midwest now has the 3rd highest death rate in the state, and is moving up fast.

U.S.  RT Rate 2020-10-16.jpg
 

Veloise

Cyburbian
Messages
5,828
Points
33
My county is experiencing a surge.

In other news, I'm responsible for several hundred of these views. (Never saw the original cartoon, so I looked that up. Good parodists: using many of the original lyrics)

 

Bubba

Cyburbian
Messages
5,454
Points
38
Yikes! Ohio now has the highest reinfection rate in the nation. It was the lowest, just a few weeks ago. A lot of the infections are coming from predominantly red counties where people are still refusing to wear masks. Darke County, one of the reddest counties in the Midwest now has the 3rd highest death rate in the state, and is moving up fast.

The hardest hit areas (currently) in Georgia are solidly blue. Results vary by user, I suppose.
 

Hink

OH....IO
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
15,934
Points
53
U of Michigan students ordered to stay-in-place, but football will play on Saturday.
Well yea... I mean football is important. ;)

Now Michigan football... maybe not as much, but...
 

kjel

Super Moderator
Staff member
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Messages
12,529
Points
42
Been invited to a wedding even with masks & social distancing - I will respectfully decline to attend.

I do know there will be no reception.
I skipped my nephew's wedding in Illinois because I would have needed to fly there which I am not comfortable with and although they trimmed the guest list quite a bit and held the reception outdoors, it just felt like too many people to be around. I would have had to quarantine for 14 days per NJ (and my employer) rules because IL has a higher transmission rate. Obviously being diabetic is a significant consideration in my decision making.

I have not eaten indoors at a restaurant since March, mostly take out-occasionally outdoor if spacing is good. I will make an occasional project site visit wearing a mask and maintaining social distance-nobody has objected. We no longer have in person meetings, conference calls or Zoom/Teams only which I do not mind at all.

NJ is on the uptick and the country as a whole is in the middle of the 3rd wave. The abdication of leadership from the federal government will be studied for years to come.
 

WSU MUP Student

Cyburbian
Messages
10,658
Points
48
I skipped my nephew's wedding in Illinois because I would have needed to fly there which I am not comfortable with and although they trimmed the guest list quite a bit and held the reception outdoors, it just felt like too many people to be around. I would have had to quarantine for 14 days per NJ (and my employer) rules because IL has a higher transmission rate. Obviously being diabetic is a significant consideration in my decision making.

I have not eaten indoors at a restaurant since March, mostly take out-occasionally outdoor if spacing is good. I will make an occasional project site visit wearing a mask and maintaining social distance-nobody has objected. We no longer have in person meetings, conference calls or Zoom/Teams only which I do not mind at all.

I haven't ate at a restaurant since March as well. we do take out once every other week or so and that's it. We are still going to the grocery store only about once every three or four weeks and (other than coming into the office once every 2 weeks) my wife and I could probably count on one hand each our number of trips inside of buildings that are not our own house.

Our office had stopped all in person meetings months ago and we have yet to resume them for the most part (as a county-level economic development agency though, we can probably get away with that a lot easier than city-level economic development or planning departments). Our building is still closed to the general public but I noticed this morning that they've gone back to posting a Sheriff's Deputy at our front entrance during working hours so maybe they're gearing up for reopening sooner rather than later.

This morning I was walking through one of our lobbies on the way to the bathroom and some woman poked her head out of a conference room to ask if I was there for "the interview" so some other departments must now be doing in-person meetings... Only after I told the woman "no", I realized I missed my opportunity to jokingly ask what the job was and if it paid better than my current position I'd happily sit down with her, regardless of my qualifications!
 

Maister

Chairman of the bored
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
28,831
Points
71
Don't know if I could handle this...

I admit I am curious about the concept. If there were Jack in the Boxes locally I might try one. What if masks featured some truly wonderful smells like movie popcorn or steak on the grill? I'm surprised more haven't already jumped on the marketing opportunity
 
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