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Curiosity?

ebeech121

Cyburbian
Messages
83
Points
4
Are most of the people who post here liberal/Democrat/left-wing/left-of-the-moderates?

I'm just curious--I noticed that "caption" thing with picture of Bush (I never saw the picture, but read the captions--stupid browser) and that most of the captions were..negative.
 

SlaveToTheGrind

Cyburbian
Messages
1,444
Points
27
Gun owning, concealed carry permit owner, truck/SUV owner, heterosexual, christian, male, and republican.:)
 

Chet

Cyburbian Emeritus
Messages
10,623
Points
34
SlaveToTheGrind said:
Gun owning, concealed carry permit owner, truck/SUV owner, heterosexual, christian, male, and republican.:)
Almost ditto.
 

Gedunker

Moderating
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
11,486
Points
41
Born Republican. Tried Democrats. Watched the rise of the right wing under Reagan. Rejected that. Saw the disarray that passes for Liberalism in the USA, and ran from that. Today I sit squarely in the utterly confused right-middle-left. B-)
 

JNA

Cyburbian Plus
Messages
25,790
Points
61
Just like a Wing Nut sometimes spun to the right or left depending on the issue, but holding on to the middle. ;-)
 

mendelman

Unfrozen Caveman Planner
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
13,902
Points
57
JNA said:
Just like a Wing Nut sometimes spun to the right or left depending on the issue, but holding on to the middle. ;-)

Very nice analogy, JNA!

I'm sorta left of center with latent compassionate real estate developer leanings wanting to get out..
 

Wulf9

Member
Messages
923
Points
22
Green Libertarian - if such a thing is possible. I also admire economic conservative Republicans and truly compassionate Democrats (not many of either in existance with the control lobbyists and big money has on both parties. BTW, Has any Californian noted how much George Bush is like Gray Davis? Strong political organization. Huge deficits because of payoffs to contributors. Paralyzed when big issues occur. The similarity is striking. But I digress.).
 
Messages
7,649
Points
29
Wulf9 said:
Green Libertarian
God, I misread that as "Green LIBRARIAN". 8-!

I think I have voted in 2 elections in my life. My sister and hubby both like to argue politics and give me hell for not voting, yadda yadda. With special needs kids, health problems, etc. voting was just not something I could crow-bar into my schedule. If I live long enough to be old and gray....er, old (cuz I am already gray :-D )... I will see if I can make-up for my misspent youth and make it to the polls more regularly.

[BS] So, what is this 'democrat/repblican' thing of which you speak??? 8-! [/BS]
 

Gedunker

Moderating
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
11,486
Points
41
Michele Zone said:
I think I have voted in 2 elections in my life.
Tsk, tsk, MZ. Many great women fought for your right to the franchise. Call for an absentee ballot and fill it out when it suits you. You are too smart not to cast a ballot. And it certainly does matter.

Just old 'dunker's $0.02
 

JNL

Cyburbian
Messages
2,449
Points
25
Did you know?

Gedunker said:
Tsk, tsk, MZ. Many great women fought for your right to the franchise.
On 19 September 1893 women's suffrage was made law in New Zealand, the first country in the world to grant women the vote :)
 

Dan

Dear Leader
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
18,703
Points
69
JNL said:
On 19 September 1893 women's suffrage was made law in New Zealand, the first country in the world to grant women the vote :)
Maybe, but sheep had the vote in 1889, which isn't saying much.

:D

Seriosuly, I consider myself a pragmatic, politically incorrect liberal with some practical libertarian leanings.
 

Budgie

Cyburbian
Messages
5,270
Points
30
The political opinion expressed on this forum tend to be all over the board. I am a "liberal" on social issues and "conservative" on fiscal matters. EG (aka. conservative ruby ridge militia wacko) and I used to spar on gun control all the time. And oddly enough we both have strong personal tied to the military.

This thread was a ****ing doozy.

http://www.cyburbia.org/forums/showthread.php?t=8657&highlight=gun+control+budgie

There used to be some scary exchanges, but we're all compadres in the end. Have no fear of being offended. The key is to not take any of it personal.
 

vaughan

Cyburbian
Messages
335
Points
11
C'mon, I'm a 27 year old college student who rides a goofy-lookin' bike and who's just getting started in planning- its against the rules for me to be anything but liberal.

What about you, elizabeth?
 
Messages
7,649
Points
29
Gedunker said:
Tsk, tsk, MZ. Many great women fought for your right to the franchise. Call for an absentee ballot and fill it out when it suits you. You are too smart not to cast a ballot. And it certainly does matter.

Just old 'dunker's $0.02
I was just a tad overwhelmed with little details like trying to continue breathing and saving my oldest son from a living hell of a future, trapped behind his many handicaps. Sometimes, you can't afford luxuries like sleeping, socializing, voting....
 

PlannerGirl

Cyburbian Plus
Messages
6,377
Points
29
I owe up to be a non christian not straight and narrow left leaning person, and mod ;-)

However I have at times had my own gun, reloaded my own brass and support our troops till the end. Just dont ask me to support their boss ;-) :-}
 

Repo Man

Cyburbian
Messages
2,549
Points
25
I tend to be left leaning with some libertarian values. I almost always support lowering taxes unless it means I will get laid off :) because there is way too much government waste. That is the one issue where the democrats wrong, we don't need to repeal the Bush tax cuts we need to look at where we can cut wasteful spending on useless programs and subsidies (not spending billions of dollars in Iraq would have been a nice start...).

I am very liberal on social issues. I always found it amazing that republicans were the party that wanted to get government out of people's lives, yet they continually try to legislate against reproductive rights, gay rights, etc.

With that being said, I despise as many democrats as I do republicans. I think John Kerry will make a very mediocre president, which of course would still be an improvement over the current administration.
 

Budgie

Cyburbian
Messages
5,270
Points
30
Repo Man said:
we don't need to repeal the Bush tax cuts we need to look at where we can cut wasteful spending on useless programs and subsidies (not spending billions of dollars in Iraq would have been a nice start).
Let's start with bloated, over engineered, latent demand producing, unnecessary highway projects. Robert Moses is rolling over in his grave.
 

pete-rock

Cyburbian
Messages
1,550
Points
24
Dan said:
...I consider myself a pragmatic, politically incorrect liberal with some practical libertarian leanings.
I'd put myself in almost exactly the same category. A little left of center. I can agree with the right on some of the social/cultural issues, but not all.
 

Tranplanner

maudit anglais
Messages
7,917
Points
36
Another fiscally conservative, socially progressive here. Up here it's what's termed a "red tory", and unfortunately we no longer have a political party that represents our views.
 

otterpop

Cyburbian
Messages
6,655
Points
28
I am middle of the road in my politics. Green on the environmental and natural reosurce issues. More conservative on law and order issues, though opposed to the death penalty. More liberal on social justice issues.

I was raised in a home of Republicans. I have voted Republican in two national elections, but I got over that. :-D

I vote the straight Democratic ticket now, because I find the Democratic Party is more in line with what is important to me than the Republicans or Libertarians. The Greens are a little too out there for me.

That is where I stand.
 

biscuit

Cyburbian
Messages
3,904
Points
25
I'm a person who is pro Second Amendment, pro drug legalization, anti deficit, pro life, against capital punishment, thinks that tax cuts are okay, strongly believes in environmental protection, thinks we should be able to opt out of Social Security if we so want, and believes that issues of personal choice (like gay marriage) are non of the governments damn business.

And that's why I'm a registered independent. :-D
 

Richmond Jake

You can't fight in here. This is the War Room!
Messages
18,313
Points
44
otterpop said:
I am middle of the road in my politics. Green on the environmental and natural reosurce issues. More conservative on law and order issues, though opposed to the death penalty. More liberal on social justice issues.

[snip]

I vote the straight Democratic ticket now, because I find the Democratic Party is more in line with what is important to me than the Republicans or Libertarians. The Greens are a little too out there for me.

That is where I stand.
This describes me, too. But grew up in a Democratic Party home. Voted for a woman a couple of times in a non-partisan election (county supervisor), who I'm sure is Republican.
 

Elisabeth

Cyburbian
Messages
157
Points
7
Officially, I'm a democrat, however, I'm thinking of switching to Independent. I think of myself as a conservative democrat, though. Or a maybe a liberal republican...
 

NHPlanner

A shadow of my former self
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
9,945
Points
40
Born and bred dem....union family, though I've softened over the years.
 

Zoning Goddess

Cyburbian
Messages
13,852
Points
39
I'm registered Independent, because I don't fit anywhere else. As stated by a couple of Cyburbians above, I'm socially progressive, fiscally conservative, with a bit of environmentalism thrown in.

I have a (small) gun and a (small) SUV, but I've never, ever watered my lawn (in Florida!). I have no patience whatsoever for anyone who screams property rights, especially when speculative. Or with politicians who spend money like they're a white-trash mama at Wal-Mart. So there!
 

el Guapo

Capitalist
Messages
5,995
Points
31
vaughan said:
C'mon, I'm a 27 year old college student who rides a goofy-lookin' bike and who's just getting started in planning- its against the rules for me to be anything but liberal.
[ot]Dude Post a photo of that bike. :)[/ot]

Me, I guess I've given up on being:
Republican - They no longer excite.
Christian - They no longer scare me.
Concealed Carry - I want to carry openly and with everyone fully aware I might cap their asses for staying in the left lane too long.
Truck/SUV owner - To much excess capacity and not enough common sense.

But I'm keeping with the pro-life, hetero, suburban lifetyle thank you very much.
 

ebeech121

Cyburbian
Messages
83
Points
4
mendelman said:
Very nice analogy, JNA!

I'm sorta left of center with latent compassionate real estate developer leanings wanting to get out..
You just used the words "compassionate" and "developer" in the same sentence. Wow. ;-)
 

ebeech121

Cyburbian
Messages
83
Points
4
vaughan said:
C'mon, I'm a 27 year old college student who rides a goofy-lookin' bike and who's just getting started in planning- its against the rules for me to be anything but liberal.

What about you, elizabeth?
I'm like what a few have already said: Moderate, and it depends on the issue. I hate abortion (any kind), the banning of gay marriages, a snoopy government (even though there is no such thing as privacy anyway) and lots of other things. Some would label me Libertarian, but even there I don't (man I hate this keyboard--stupid Dells!) agree with everything. I don't think I could be labeled one thing, but that people should ask me first what I think.

Going to a very liberal college is rather annoying though with all the protests on this "war".

And as for the president, here's my stance: The Republicans would be happy if he was re-elected. And if the Democrats are smart, they would live with it because Bush couldn't be president again. It's a win-win situation.

P.S. I'm a 21 year old college student in an urban setting that is both a "gay mecca" and a "black mecca". Don't get me wrong, those things add fun and diversity to Atlanta, but they also affect politics.
 

Maister

Chairman of the bored
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
28,693
Points
71
I think BKM has already chanted my personal mantra: "unrepentant lefty" but skeptical of 'true believers' of any stripe.

Don't tell Michaelskis that I hold some pretty fiscally conservative beliefs dear but for the sake of keeping a running argument going in the office I play an outright Commie....
 

Duke Of Dystopia

Cyburbian
Messages
2,713
Points
24
ebeech121 said:
Are most of the people who post here liberal/Democrat/left-wing/left-of-the-moderates?
.......
You miss the point completly.

The real point is how committed are you to this 200 year old experiment called democracy. Will you let simple, and often foolish party loyalty get in the way of good sense?

If you are conservative, would you give up your civil rights to the leader of your party? or would you reject your leaders to save your way of life?

If you are a liberal, is everything "It's all good" to the point where you can't make any kind of judgement, and the whole experiment fails?

My question to you is why does it matter what party loyalty we have? What will you do to work with others to make a better place to live?

When do your leaders become the real problem, i.e. the oath as many of us us took as servicemember took to "Defend the US from all enemies forign AND DOMESTIC"?
 

pete-rock

Cyburbian
Messages
1,550
Points
24
Duke Of Dystopia said:
My question to you is why does it matter what party loyalty we have? What will you do to work with others to make a better place to live?
I could not agree with you more, Duke. No matter what the party affiliation, I want more Americans to be more committed to making better communities and a better nation (I intentionally omitted "making better families" because that, IMHO, is the limit of government encroachment). Too many Americans are selfishly using our political and economic systems strictly for their own personal gain.

Altruistic and idealistic? Yes. But we all have dreams.
 

tsc

Cyburbian
Messages
1,905
Points
23
I have a pretty big SUV (japanese)...but also an old volvo, I have a gun (flare), ... and I am a liberal left-wing NY democrat working in the public sector who doesn't mind have Hillary living 15 miles away from the place I call home. :-D
 

Duke Of Dystopia

Cyburbian
Messages
2,713
Points
24
pete-rock said:
.......
Altruistic and idealistic? Yes. But we all have dreams.
As far as altruism goes, we have the concept so it must exist, but it is so rare it is statisticaly nonexistent. That being said, people can still work together and make things work with thier own goals in mind. Often, people want the same things, but view different paths to get there. This means rigidly following a party or single leader gets in the way of acomplishing something.

No system is perfect :(
 

biscuit

Cyburbian
Messages
3,904
Points
25
Duke Of Dystopia said:
As far as altruism goes, we have the concept so it must exist, but it is so rare it is statisticaly nonexistent. That being said, people can still work together and make things work with thier own goals in mind. Often, people want the same things, but view different paths to get there. This means rigidly following a party or single leader gets in the way of acomplishing something.

No system is perfect :(
Paging Ann Rand, paging Ann Rand...
 

Duke Of Dystopia

Cyburbian
Messages
2,713
Points
24
biscuit said:
Paging Ann Rand, paging Ann Rand...
Never read ANY of her books or been a follower.

I suggest over MANY beers one night, you find a smart friend (yeah easy to do around alcahol :) ) and then one plays the proponent of altruism, and one plays the skeptic. At the end of the night, you will have less of a grip on altruism than you have now.

I am optomistic though, I hope it can be proved to exist in the world some day. It would prove that their is DEFINATLY a greater power than ones self. As it is, I have to take it on faith. :)
 

Gedunker

Moderating
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
11,486
Points
41
Is this man an example?

Pat Tillman, the star football player with the Arizona Cardinals turned down a $3.6 million contract to join the Army Rangers post Sept'r 11. He was killed in action with the 75th Ranger Battalion in Afghanistan, the Army just reported.

Heroic, for sure. Altruistic? What say you DoD?
 

ebeech121

Cyburbian
Messages
83
Points
4
Duke Of Dystopia said:
Will you let simple, and often foolish party loyalty get in the way of good sense?

My question to you is why does it matter what party loyalty we have? What will you do to work with others to make a better place to live?
If you will re-read my post, you will notice that I mentioned at least four non-party categories of political leanings. I don't care what party loyatly people here have, I care about their opinions and points-of-view on politics.

And about working with others...what does my question have to do with cooperating with others? Are you assuming that since I ask, that I will not cooperate with people who have different points-of-view than me?

Also, I have not been nor am I currently a "servicemember", so I did not take that oath. I pledge alligence to the United States, and it's been more than 200 years.
 

Duke Of Dystopia

Cyburbian
Messages
2,713
Points
24
Gedunker said:
Is this man an example?

Pat Tillman, the star football player with the Arizona Cardinals turned down a $3.6 million contract to join the Army Rangers post Sept'r 11. He was killed in action with the 75th Ranger Battalion in Afghanistan, the Army just reported.

Heroic, for sure. Altruistic? What say you DoD?

Sadly Gedunker, I have to say that this is not a case of altruism. I will agree that he was a person of tremendous character and courage.

Definition:
Concern for the welfare of others, as opposed to egoism; Selflessness.

1) He has a stake (self interest) in the system in which he lived.
2) He felt threatened enough, and strongly enough, that it topped all other considerations in his life. In other words, he was acting in self interest to a percieved threat.
3) True, that he had a list of things many see as not worth giving up for possibly little or no value but with large risk. But, had he come through alive, he stood very much to gain from his experience. He was a smart man, and he would have profitted greatly from such an experience personally. Not the definition of selflessness.
4) He was supporting the same system he had so much success within. If successful, he would expect that his offspring be nearly as successful as himself within that system. Not the definition of selflessness.
5) I could think of more, but this is a good start.

Please understand, I think we need more people like him, in every walk of life. I find his story compelling and admirable. I just don't believe it was altruism. I am sorry about that.
 

Budgie

Cyburbian
Messages
5,270
Points
30
Is anyone here a Nihilist?

Altruism exists to varying degrees. IMO, a civil society relies on altruism to build social capital and the belief in the law of reciprocity. Unfortunately a capitalist society relies on the exact opposite, acting in rational self interest. As long as our society (and we by extension) value and indeed stresses self over community, we are headed to societal failure either through oppression or anarchy. Having said that, throughout human history all great societies have ultimately failed. The United States will do the same due to our national egotistical self importance. The question is do we head to distruction the "D" or "R" way.

So in the immortal words of Alfred E. Newman, "What me worry?"
 

Duke Of Dystopia

Cyburbian
Messages
2,713
Points
24
ebeech121 said:
If you will re-read my post, you will notice that I mentioned at least four non-party categories of political leanings. I don't care what party loyatly people here have, I care about their opinions and points-of-view on politics.

And about working with others...what does my question have to do with cooperating with others? Are you assuming that since I ask, that I will not cooperate with people who have different points-of-view than me?

Also, I have not been nor am I currently a "servicemember", so I did not take that oath. I pledge alligence to the United States, and it's been more than 200 years.
Are most of the people who post here liberal/Democrat/left-wing/left-of-the-moderates?

There, I reread it!


1) Why would you ask the question if you don't care?
2) You asked people to self identify, more or less. My proof is everybody answered that way. I only stated that I found that irelevent, as those of us who have been around a while, know where others lean. My point is that self identification up front obfuscates the real point of issues rather than helping.
3) Its ok that you didn't serve. The pledge is a good start, I even agree, "one nation, under Gods". But to take things further, I will now ask you a new question.

Since you didn't serve you feel the need to turn a blind eye to the enemies of this nation if they are white WASPS from the south and can speak at least 4 words of nearly unbroken english? Huh. What constitutes an enemy, internal OR external? Even if this administration is NOT trying to ruin the experiment, once he increases his authority to act, and reduces civil liberites for all, what is to stop the next meathead down the line from acting in a more malicious manner? People with power do not willingly give it up once they have it.

Clinton got hammered here too. Everybody gets hammered here. Pithy responses and disagreement are the norm. Nobody ever answeres these questions. Either they are to tough, or they just don't care. Hell, it could be me asking stupid questions. I bet Tillman was stupid to, for caring.

200 plus years and your going to quible over the ( + ) ? Your going to be fun on these boards :)
 

Budgie

Cyburbian
Messages
5,270
Points
30
Duke Of Dystopia said:
What constitutes an enemy, internal OR external?
That's simple -- anyone EG wants to shot.;) EG is our resident expert on the "enemy".
 

Budgie

Cyburbian
Messages
5,270
Points
30
Duke Of Dystopia said:
Even if this administration is NOT trying to ruin the experiment, once he increases his authority to act, and reduces civil liberites for all, what is to stop the next meathead down the line from acting in a more malicious manner? People with power do not willingly give it up once they have it.
This dovetails into my previous point that all great societies ultimately fail due to extremes of oppression (loss of civil liberties, excessive rational self interest for a few) or anarchy (complete loss of societal boundaries, excessive rational self interest for every individual). It is a vortex that feeds on itself. Once ground is given, it's extremely difficult to get it back. Is democracy strong enough to withstand the pushing and pulling? Maybe, but the same democracy can be very different societies at different points in time.
 

Budgie

Cyburbian
Messages
5,270
Points
30
Maister said:
Don't tell Michaelskis that I hold some pretty fiscally conservative beliefs ....
Which "fiscally conservatives beliefs" are you alluding to?
 

Duke Of Dystopia

Cyburbian
Messages
2,713
Points
24
Budgie said:
.....Is democracy strong enough to withstand the pushing and pulling? Maybe, but the same democracy can be very different societies at different points in time.
Agreed, also with your above statement. It is worth trying to save. I am not claiming altruism though, I like our system as it is (generally) and think it is worth fighting for. All things can be improved on.
 

mendelman

Unfrozen Caveman Planner
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
13,902
Points
57
Budgie said:
Which "fiscally conservatives beliefs" are you alluding to?
Not using taxpayers' hard-earned money to support slacker government workers using cyburbia, and being generally lazy. ;-)

I have to go on my 3-hour lunch now. :p
 
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