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Flu season

Zoning Goddess

Cyburbian
Messages
13,852
Points
39
Who's doing the flu vaccine frenzy? Here, thousands are lining up for hundreds of available vaccines at health departments and hospitals. Maybe because Orlando gets so many visitors from everywhere, we know it's coming. I will not be surprised if riots break out where vaccines are available.

I got my shot last month. My son had an appointment today (made weeks ago) for a shot and yearly physical. They were out when we arrived. I am sure that since I called, dozens of yuppie moms brought little Austin/Emily in and insisted they get a shot, thus using up my kid's promised vaccine. I found a D.O. who has available Flumist, so he'll get his vaccine on Monday. I think he's the only doctor in the county with any vaccine whatsoever.
 
Messages
16
Points
1
IMHO, vulnerable populations aside, we need to work up resistance to bacteria and viruses, rather than vaccinate and medicate ourselves. The Health and Safety committee at my workplace continues to ram the flu shot down employees’ throats (which, surely has a lot to do with the reduction of sick days but seems to backfire as many are, strangely, off work for part or all of the week following their shot). In addition, my province has begun its propaganda campaign with a new twist this year; blaming the flu’s existence on people who don’t get the shot! Nice!

Sorry, to get to my point…I’m reading a great book about epidemics and on the streetcar on the way home from work today I read this…

The ability of the flu virus to mutate and change shape every ten to fourteen years (the interval is not always this predictable) also makes influenza invincible. Scientists have looked hard for the strain that caused the epidemic of 1918 but have never found it because the flu virus has two special molecules on its outer surface that act as cell thieves; they provide whatever tools the virus needs to kidnap a cell, whether a cellular key, hammer or credit card. But every time a virus reproduces itself, a small part of these surface molecules is incorrectly copied, and over time the molecules change their arrangement like chess men. After generations of mutations, antibodies from the immune system can no longer identify the rearranged outer shell of the virus, and a new flu is born. Rapid mutations account for the disappearance of some viral strains and the emergence of new ones. They also explain why vaccine makers are always a step behind flu viruses. (pp. 167-168)
Nikiforuk, Andrew. 1996. The Fourth Horseman, Penguin books. Toronto

…Wha??? Pardon? Where the hell has this info been hiding? On one hand, you have the CDC saying that Vaccination is 'The single best way to prevent the flu'
and on the other hand, there are web articles such as this one, titled, 'Six Ways to Avoid the Winter Flu--and a Flu Shot Isn't One of Them' …on why not to get the shot...
The flu vaccine can actually weaken the immune system and make you more predisposed to the illness. And the side effects of FluMist, cough, runny nose/nasal congestion, irritability, headaches, chills, muscle aches and fever, sound just like the symptoms of the flu….you will get not only a live flu virus in each dose but also table sugar and MSG

So, what are people to think? Well, Cancerweb has a medical dictionary, with a true and honest account, albeit very ‘termy’, of our knowledge of Influenza and basically confirms, in medical terms (there are links to almost every term, including non-medical), what Nikiforuk was saying. Also, it’s pretty much common knowledge at this point that there is a new strain of flu about that is not included in this year’s vaccine…although, a ‘cousin’, if you will, is and they are hoping it helps…so, it looks like this year or soon, anyway, we’ll get a real clear view of what he was talking about when he said the vaccine makers are always a step behind.

Sorry for all the doom and gloom but I’m pretty pissed that I have to stumble onto this kind of info while gov’ts the world over facilitate the profits of pharmaceutical companies. I also realize that I am lucky to be making a choice for only myself…ie. No elderly or kids to decide for.
 

ludes98

Cyburbian
Messages
1,264
Points
22
Child here died last week. Since then there has been a mad rush of course. Supposed to have 2200 doses shipped in this weekend.
 

Dan

Dear Leader
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
18,706
Points
69
Got my shot a few weeks ago. There was no shortage of dosages for County workers. :)

Even then, the strain that's killing kids in Colorado is somewhat different than the strain the vaccination is supposed to protect you from.
 

Rumpy Tunanator

Cyburbian
Messages
4,473
Points
25
They ran out of the vaccine here. People are starting to freak out...until the next shipment arrives.
I never had a flu shot before and I don't think I ever will get one. I go with the motto "let nature take its course".
 

SGB

Cyburbian
Messages
3,388
Points
26
My wife & I are both members of "vulnerable populations," but we missed out on the vacine when it was still available here.

I'll be going with the FluMist thingy sometime next week; my wife needs to check w/ her doc about what to do, being in her second trimester and all.
 

giff57

Corn Burning Fool
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
5,443
Points
34
Got mine two weeks ago, before the rush. I was at the doc for something else and she asked if I wanted one, so I thought what the hell. No I am glad I did. The vac. does not get every strain, but the strains are enough alike that it will help lessen the severity if you happen to get one of the odd strains.
 

Chet

Cyburbian Emeritus
Messages
10,623
Points
34
I've never bothered to get the shot. I guess I just never gave it much thought.
 

kms

Cyburbian
Messages
6,425
Points
40
I had a flu shot about 10 years ago, but must have already been exposed, since I became sicker than I can ever remember.

One of my kids has asthma, so he gets a flu shot every year, and my husband gets one, too. The other two kids and I didn't get one. Not that there are any to be had around here, anyway.

I figure if we can make it to Christmas without getting the flu we should be OK. The kids can pick up any illness at school, so we have the "germ talk" every day.
 
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7,649
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FYI: According to my News Hound sister, Flu-mist seems to be more effective than the shot this year, probably because it is a live vaccine and the shot is a killed vaccine. Of course, live vaccines are also more dangerous, which is why there are so many warnings about who should NOT take flu-mist.

I got a shot this year and last year. It has to do with going several times a year to my specialist who treats my respiratory problems et al. They say "have you had your shot yet?" I say "No, am I supposed to get one?" and then a nurse shows up with a syringe. Sigh. So I dutifully roll up my sleeve.

My son's doctors handle it differently. They don't have a syringe right then and there, in hand. They just remind me that he needs one and to make the arrangments "locally" (these specialists are in another city, 45 miles away). He is 16 and very smart and it is his body, so I tend to discuss such things with him and make a judgment call as to whether he has a good argument/reason. Last year he informed me that he would rather get the flu than the flu shot. I respected his wishes and did not take him for a shot. I don't think he ever got the flu. This year, he again insisted he would rather have the flu than the shot. My sister is nagging hard for me to take my kids, what with more people dying this time around. I will probably handle that the way I handle a lot of things: what with having health problems, if it isn't super important to me, I often just never get around to it.

CityGrrl, I have a friend (Coincidentally, also Canadian) who has a severely asthmatic son. She used to be a registered nurse and has had to learn a whole lot of alternative medicine because her son has severe and potentially deadly allergic reactions to antibiotics. She is very against vaccines. I have a lot of respect for her opinions because her medical advice has been far more valuable to me than that of most doctors and my health has improved dramatically since she and I began exchanging advice. (Of course her son's health has also improved with what she learned from me. If I didn't know a little about how the body works, the doctors would have killed me in 2001.)

In case any of y'all don't realize it, the whole idea behind vaccines is that they give you a slight infection, let your body have its immune reaction to being slightly ill, and hope that this prevents you from getting deathly ill -- IF you get exposed. So, you are agreeing to a 100% chance to (hopefully!) only be a little sick in order to avoid taking your chances on getting exposed at all. Some of the vaccines they give our kids -- MMR, etc -- contain Mercury, a known poison, and these vaccines are linked to incidence of Autism and related disorders (coincidentally, I haven't posted much to cyburbia in part because I got dragged into a lengthy -- 2 week long -- discussion on Autism Spectrum Disorders, particularly Asperger's Syndrome, in another forum recently). Many autistic kids were perfectly normal toddlers -- until they got their 2 year vaccines. There is other research I have heard of that doesn't specifically attribute the effect to the Mercury content of some vaccines but still links onset of Autistic symptoms to vaccines. And that is just the tip of the iceberg -- the stuff I am most familiar with because it is relevant to my life. But I have seen other things that suggest we should be more cautious with vaccines.

Sigh.

Which is a long way of saying that while I am willing to play Russian Roulette with my own body and let my doctor subject me to a vaccine, I will not force this on my 16 year old who doesn't want it.
 

donk

Cyburbian
Messages
6,970
Points
30
First off, I am scared to death of needles (I know it is an irrational phobia), second I tend to agree with citygrrl, our bodies need to be able to fend for themselves and purposely injecting yourself with something that you know is bad for you makes little sense to me. Finally, i don't feel like waiting in line for 1-2 hours and having to pay $20 for it. (So much for socialized medicine)

If I get sick I have 30-40 sick days banked. I coud get every strain of flu this year and still have time owed.
 
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7,649
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29
donk said:
First off, I am scared to death of needles (I know it is an irrational phobia),
Donk, it may not be a totally irrational fear. I have a terrible time with shots or getting blood drawn. I have long joked that giving birth to a 9 1/2 pound baby with no pain medicine was easier than dealing with needles. When I got my flu shot this year, the nurse commented that my skin is tougher than most and really resisted -- that most of the time, there is no resistance to the needle but my skin is different. So she said she is not surprised that I just dread shots. Maybe you have some similar problem.
 

Plannerbabs

Cyburbian
Messages
1,037
Points
23
No flu shot here, although they were offered free ( I think) to government employees. Never had one, rarely get that sick, although right now I"m feeling crappy because of having to get an MMR shot for my marriage license. Grrrr. Mr. future Plannerbabs doesn't have to do anything, and I have to get a mild form of measles so we can get married, based on our state's assumption that as soon as the ink on the license is dry, we'll go off and create good little new citizens, and that if I weren't vaccinated, they'd all be vegetables and not contribute to our state's sinking economy. Grr. And as MichelleZone mentions, the vaccines could backfire seriously anyway.
sorry, feeling cranky and sick right now, going to drink more tea.
 
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7,649
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29
MMR actually stands for "measles, mumps, and rubella". If I recall correctly, Rubella is "German Measles" -- and your state may be requiring this because, if you get German Measles while pregnant, it does have serious consequences for the baby. I do have my criticisms of vaccines but I can't say the world would be a better place with more folks crippled and unable to walk due to Polio. There are reasons vaccines were developed. I just don't think the flu rates up there with Polio and some of the others that prompted the development of vaccines. I know people die from it, but I tend to feel that a flu shot is for "wimps" who don't want to suffer (sorry to anyone who voluntarily goes for a flu shot -- I never did and I am annoyed that this is being forced upon me now that I am identified as a member of a "vulnerable population". Yeah, that makes a lot of sense: now that you know I have a compromised immune system, go ahead and intentionally inject me with something to make me ill. That will surely improve my quality of life -- NOT! Maybe next year I will bitchily refuse to roll up my sleeve.)

Plannerbabs, FWIW, I had to get some vaccine I was missing when I returned to college in my late 20's. My stoic child -- who always wanted to be the strong, silent type and who had cried the week before when he got a vaccination -- found it very psychologically healing that Mom didn't deal too well either. I think he was 3 or 4 and I took him with me to get my shot. The reassurances the week before mostly fell on deaf little ears. Watching mom suffer had him repeating my reassurances to himself like a Major Revelation -- a la "It REALLY IS OKAY to cry!"
 

Jeff

Cyburbian
Messages
4,161
Points
27
The people who are freaking out are the same ones who wouldn't get the thing if we had millions of doses left.

People, we got along fine before the vaccine. Its the damn flu for crissakes not the plague. So you may get sick for a few days, and maybe 1 out of every 5 million will die from it.
 

Cardinal

Cyburbian
Messages
10,080
Points
34
Jeff said:
The people who are freaking out are the same ones who wouldn't get the thing if we had millions of doses left.

People, we got along fine before the vaccine. Its the damn flu for crissakes not the plague. So you may get sick for a few days, and maybe 1 out of every 5 million will die from it.
Absolutely correct. The last time I had the flu shot was 1990, and it made me sick. Over the last twelve seasons I have probably not had the flu more than a couple times. Unless you are a particularly susceptible person, it just isn't worth it.
 

Floridays

Cyburbian
Messages
769
Points
21
Michele Zone said:
Donk, it may not be a totally irrational fear. I have a terrible time with shots or getting blood drawn. I have long joked that giving birth to a 9 1/2 pound baby with no pain medicine was easier than dealing with needles. When I got my flu shot this year, the nurse commented that my skin is tougher than most and really resisted -- that most of the time, there is no resistance to the needle but my skin is different. So she said she is not surprised that I just dread shots. Maybe you have some similar problem.
No, it is not at all an irrational fear. I can't even LOOK at a syringe without all of the blood draining from my face. Anyway, one of my co-workers went to get the flu "nasal mist" last week...guess who's been out sick since then!
 

Tranplanner

maudit anglais
Messages
7,917
Points
37
I'm in the "let nature take its course" camp. My irrational/rational fear of needles has nothing to do with refusing the shot ;)
 

PlannerGirl

Cyburbian Plus
Messages
6,377
Points
29
Im in a population that should have the shot and i took it-ONCE and got sicker than I ever want to be again. over 2 weeks out of work.

People are morons end of story. They get over excited, freak out and forget they are not the ONLY damn people on the face of the earth. These are the same people that want antibiotics for a virus and end up making the rest of us sicker. Or they have antibactiral everything and help make monsterbugs.

Flumist is fine for some folks but can make those around you sick-no thanks

The shot screwed me up-no thanks

Id rather take my chances with the flu.
 

Plannerbabs

Cyburbian
Messages
1,037
Points
23
Exactly. I mean, yeah, the flu can be bad, but it is still just the flu. This whole shot/antibacterial lotion/soap/running to the doctor for antibiotics for a cold has just gotten out of hand, and it's going to come back at us somehow. I'd rather just get sick and get immune the old-fashioned way. Only got the MMR shot because of the possibility of another person being involved.
 

biscuit

Cyburbian
Messages
3,904
Points
25
I have had the flu only once and that was during my freshman year of college - no real suprise because all male dormitories are not exactly known as the cleanest and healthiest places on earth. Anyway, it was a nasty bug that turned eventually turned into mild pneumonia that had me out of commission for over three weeks. And do you know one of the treatments for pneumonia? It's two shots with LARGE syringes, one in each butt cheek. Needless to say I'd rather get one tiny shot and have taken the flu vaccine every year since.
 

Seabishop

Cyburbian
Messages
3,838
Points
25
I've never had the vacine and I don't know if I've had the flu.

What's the difference between the flu and a really bad cold?
 

Habanero

Cyburbian
Messages
3,241
Points
27
Seabishop said:
I've never had the vacine and I don't know if I've had the flu.

What's the difference between the flu and a really bad cold?
Body aches I think, and troubel keeping food in/down.

James and I caught the bug this weekend, I'm at home repairing myself as we leave for vacation on Saturday. I'd rather not be on an 18 hour drive with our pups with a sick man in the car, there is only so much a girl can take.

I don't get shots. I hate them.
 

Rumpy Tunanator

Cyburbian
Messages
4,473
Points
25
Seabishop said:
I've never had the vacine and I don't know if I've had the flu.

What's the difference between the flu and a really bad cold?
The terrible hallucinations were you think somebody is coming to your bed side to help you, but in reality, nobody is there. Kind of like food poisoning.
 

mendelman

Unfrozen Caveman Planner
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
13,911
Points
57
I third Donk, et al.

I received a flu shot once and it made me feel terrible. Will not do it again. I'm not in a vulnerable group, so it doesn't worry me.

I seldom ever get sick, so 'Meh!'
 

martini

Cyburbian
Messages
678
Points
19
Hype! I've had the flu once when I was young. I don't remember it being that bad. I'd rather take my chances at this point. The whole vaccine thing has me all freaked out. The wife and I are debating not having the kidling vaccinated. Like ZG and CG, we've done some research, and deliberately putting poinson into my child is something I don't want to do.

I'm also a firm beliver that if you don't get sick once in a while, your immune system is gradually weakened, leaving you even more vulnerable. Seems to me that this is how the nervous system is designed to work, right? As a society, we're getting pretty soft.

3.1 million deaths from AIDS per year.
36,000 deaths from Influenza per year.
whats more important? (both are world wide stats.)
 
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7,649
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29
Just a side note: for those folks saying that everyone taking so many antibiotics is a "problem" -- it is a tiny part of the problem. The much bigger problem is the amount of antibiotics, etc, that gets fed to farm animals. If you are really concerned about antibiotic resistence, et al, you should be whigging out about that far more than about how many antibiotics humans consume. I have read some stuff that indicates that girls are menstruating younger and younger due to the amount of steroids and crap in our beef products. My kids hardly eat red meat. Maybe that it part of why they have yet to "discover girls" -- a problem I am all too happy to NOT have. Let them grow up slow. I did and that meant that I was old enough to use birth control from the start and.... now I am really off topic. "Shutting up now"
 
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