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NAFTA "Truckways"

ChevyChaseDC

Cyburbian
Messages
190
Points
7
So-called "truckways" ...what is their advantage? Is it more cost-effective for long-distance hauling than freight trains? Are truckways going to increase fatalities by encouraging increases in big rig traffic? Are they a pork-barrel project for the highway construction lobby?

NAFTA. Sigh.
 

mgk920

Cyburbian
Messages
4,202
Points
26
ChevyChaseDC said:
So-called "truckways" ...what is their advantage? Is it more cost-effective for long-distance hauling than freight trains? Are truckways going to increase fatalities by encouraging increases in big rig traffic? Are they a pork-barrel project for the highway construction lobby?

NAFTA. Sigh.

I am not really turned on by dedicated 'truckways' per se, as I believe that railroads would be a far better way of moving trailers and containers long distances. The big downside, assuming that the economic numbers are otherwise there (perhaps including various 'incentives') is a general lack of capacity of the railroads themselves. Throughout the 1960s into the 1990s, railroads 'rationalized' a LOT of their facilities through mergers and abandonments, leaving a system that can barely handle what it is now being called upon to carry.

Part of that are laws that treat active railroad RsOW as taxable property, unlike the tax-supported RsOW that are generally used by trucking companies. Yes, they do pay fuel and other taxes, along with an occassional direct toll, but not at levels anywhere near enough to cover the costs of the wear and tear damage that they do to those facilities nor to the level of 'utility' that they receive in return for those tax and toll payments.

I sometimes wonder what the USA's railroad industry would look like today if their active RsOW were property tax exempt.

Mike
 
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AubieTurtle

Cyburbian
Messages
894
Points
21
The railroads once had the most powerful lobby in the country. Now the ashfault crew is in charge and the railroads can't even get a level playing field. Makes me wonder if someday the road lobby will be similarily marginalized.

Semi-related: In addition to HOT lanes, Georgia is considering TOT (Truck Only Toll) lanes that would similarly be only for truck traffic.
 
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The One

Cyburbian
Messages
8,289
Points
30
Independent truckers

Look, all I know is that if truckers are so independent, why can't they do 100% of their driving in non rush hour (city) times???? Don't give me that "we don't set the schedule, the buyer does" garbage! And the majority of over the road travel at night!!! Say between 7PM and 6AM!! Even the corporate guys could make this work! Many of them could be paid a flat rate (many are anyway) for their runs...and end bonus $ for early arrivals (encourages driving straight through).....
 

iamme

Cyburbian
Messages
485
Points
14
I have a nice Q & A section that I will sponser now. It's called "ask someone that is a manager at a trucking terminal". Since I am a manager at a trucking terminal I would have to say some things. 1. It is all about the customer, if we won't pickup/deliver something promptly and to the customers' specifications, we just lost that business. 2. Most freight moves during the day (at least for us); Pickup and deliveries are during the day and we move the freight between terminals at night. 3. As far as your driving straight through, there are federal laws that prohibit a driver from doing that for safety purposes.

I've wondered the same thing about truckways and thought how they just look like a very inefficient version of railways.


The One said:
Look, all I know is that if truckers are so independent, why can't they do 100% of their driving in non rush hour (city) times???? Don't give me that "we don't set the schedule, the buyer does" garbage! And the majority of over the road travel at night!!! Say between 7PM and 6AM!! Even the corporate guys could make this work! Many of them could be paid a flat rate (many are anyway) for their runs...and end bonus $ for early arrivals (encourages driving straight through).....
 

giff57

Corn Burning Fool
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
5,448
Points
34
The One said:
Look, all I know is that if truckers are so independent, why can't they do 100% of their driving in non rush hour (city) times???? Don't give me that "we don't set the schedule, the buyer does" garbage! And the majority of over the road travel at night!!! Say between 7PM and 6AM!! Even the corporate guys could make this work! Many of them could be paid a flat rate (many are anyway) for their runs...and end bonus $ for early arrivals (encourages driving straight through).....


You need to do a little research on "Just In Time" . Most maunfacturers are going to JIT and not carrying inventory. So if a plant runs 24hrs a day then shipping and deliveries do too.
 

The One

Cyburbian
Messages
8,289
Points
30
Jit

As with most things, if JIT doesn't work for society (traffic congestion :-# /pollution :-# /Rushed Drivers 8-! ), then it goes away..Reminds me of the time Domino's Pizza Drivers were killing people to get their $10 pizza to some schmuck on time in the early 90's (30 minutes or less policy)!!!!..This industry could REALLY benefit (profit) from a little (long range planning)! But I also agree that those making the orders need to change at the same time (sounds like they ought to talk to each other)
 

jordanb

Cyburbian
Messages
3,232
Points
25
The funny thing about JIT is that, if it were to work, it would represent significant efficiency savings for our industry. The problem with it, of course, is that our transportation system is so unreliable in this country: the roads are congested, the railroads are a wreck, and airplanes have never been reliable and never will be.

Now if we hadn't torn up all of that never-to-be-replaced railroad infestructure in the '60s and 70's, imagine what could have been.
 

iamme

Cyburbian
Messages
485
Points
14
Imagine yet if the infrastructure had kept up with the freight volumes. I think what the rail industry can best do now is to chip away at trucking companies public subsidies (indirect subsidies) and get some more of their own (in the form of property tax exemptions for their rail lines).

side note: Hey, with the Bush administration's quest for tax cuts like Walmart's quest for low prices, this might be the best time for them to act.


jordanb said:
The funny thing about JIT is that, if it were to work, it would represent significant efficiency savings for our industry. The problem with it, of course, is that our transportation system is so unreliable in this country: the roads are congested, the railroads are a wreck, and airplanes have never been reliable and never will be.

Now if we hadn't torn up all of that never-to-be-replaced railroad infestructure in the '60s and 70's, imagine what could have been.
 

Rumpy Tunanator

Cyburbian
Messages
4,473
Points
25
ChevyChaseDC said:
So-called "truckways" ...what is their advantage? Is it more cost-effective for long-distance hauling than freight trains? Are truckways going to increase fatalities by encouraging increases in big rig traffic? Are they a pork-barrel project for the highway construction lobby?

NAFTA. Sigh.

The so-called advantage would be the addition of lanes to existing interstates exclusively for trucks. Basically you'd be taking existing trucks off the interstate and putting them in restricted toll lanes for trucks. These tollways (studies at the moment) are being supported by many of the major trucking companies.

http://www.rppi.org/ps316.pdf

http://www.rppi.org/ps294.pdf

Actually I think shipping freight via railroads is still cheaper.

http://www.transact.org/library/decoder/rail_decoder.pdf
 

The One

Cyburbian
Messages
8,289
Points
30
Only if Private

Rumpy:

Great idea, as long as the truckways are 100% privately funded. Why should the public pay billions of $$ for the nearly exclusive use of a private industry?! Airports cost billions, and they support private airlines (at a price) but they are still "public airports", primarily for public uses (UPS/Airborne Exp. and FedEx all pay to use the facilities). A toll road could work, if developed under a private corp. Private airports are not open to the public and are funded entirley by the private owner. Same thing with Railroads with the exception of amtrack and a few commuter rail services running on private lines.....
 
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