Putting my life in the hands of the Throbbing Brain...

[Cardinal]

Whenever confronted with a difficult decision, seek out responsible advice from people you know and trust. If that doesn't work, turn to Cyburbia.

Over a year ago, I began a job search, as I was not pleased with the direction of my board and the community as a whole. In the next few months I was invited to interview at several places. Some I turned down the opportunity to interview. Others did not offer me the job. Some offered me the job, but because I did not like the community, or the salary was unrealistic, I declined.

In the meantime, some of the local businesses confronted my board to advocate on my behalf. My most problematic board member left. Another changed his ways, and eventually stepped down. A third was not reappointed. Suddenly, I have a board that is eager to take on new projects, a supportive city council, and now even the city manager, who has been a frequent obstacle, resigned. It looks like a promising time, and frankly, the projects I have lined up excite me.

So here's the problem. The last resume I sent out, back in February, is bearing some fruit. I had a telephone interview and was invited to interview in person. Now they want to check my references and do a background check, and asked if there is anyone I would like to fly out with me to see the city. This is a well-known, progressive community with an outstanding reputation in planning circles (although this is a first shot at economic development). We have not talked salary, but I expect the pay is much better, approaching six figures. Then again, it would have to be, as the cost of living is much higher.

Do I stay where I am, with a promising future and interesting projects, close to my family and friends, in a state where I know the statutes and have a wide professional network, with a low cost of living and opportunities to do the things I enjoy (like gardening)? Or do I take the risk and move to the high-profile community? It would certainly be putting me on the track to future jobs in top management.

Hmmm.... Anyone want to help methink through this one?

 

[Michele Zone]

Short answer: If you actually want to ever have any hope of marrying, leave town now. If you like being a perpetual bachelor, keep thinking about what is great about the rural town with no women to date. (I am assuming "higher cost of living = more population in the area" ..ie. it is a larger community.)

Does that help?

 

[giff57]

I am sure you are doing this but:

Can you be happy in a high profile place?
How important are birds, garden, open space?
I agree with MZ the mate chances are improved, but perhaps hindered by being very high profile.
How important is the money? (personally, living where you do, with a comfortable income is more important than big money for me)

Do you really want to be a high profile manager some day?

 

[SGB]

Think about it: What do you really have to lose by pursuing what could be a fantastic opportunity for you?

I say check it out, and see if and what they have to offer.

 

[Michele Zone]

I agree with MZ the mate chances are improved, but perhaps hindered by being very high profile.

Maybe. Or maybe not. I, personally, doubt that taking a high profile position would hinder his chances of finding a viable candidate for a mate. Cardinal is a very intelligent man. That has probably been his biggest hurdle to finding a woman he could be happy with. My suspicion is that the high profile position will not only put him in a geographic area with more sheer numbers of women but also will be likely to put him in contact with more women who have some chance of being his intellectual equal. Fulfilling a role that is commensurate with his ability will signal honestly how much a woman needs to be able to handle. His present position probably masks the truth of just how competent he is -- and that probably hinders hooking up in an authentic way with a woman who has a real chance of making a good mate for him more than a high profile would.

Cardinal shouldn't do anything that does not fulfill him, personally, in hopes of finding a mate. Being himself is the best way to find someone who is a good match for him. But I think the high profile position is more commensurate with who he is. Heck he has a high profile HERE, in Cyburbia -- with a zillion posts -- even though he isn't a moderator. And I know he reigns himself in and intentionally posts LESS than he could, out of "guilt". I do the same thing. Cardinal would likely be happier in a high profile position. I am happier when I have such positions and when it is seen as "my job" to run my mouth. (You don't see anyone telling Dan or Chet or eG that they "post too much" and "shut the F*** up!" -- they are SUPPOSED to post a lot. It is "their job" here.) If he took the high profile, risky job, Cardinal probably wouldn't have to reign himself in so much. He could, at long last, stretch himself. And, like being cramped in a car all day and finally getting out and being able to stretch your legs, escaping the confines of a position that is too cramped can feel wonderful.

I deleted all my comments about my personal experiences. If Cardinal wants to know my anecdotal evidence that supports my above point of view, he can PM me or e-mail me.

Disclaimer: I don't actually think I know everything. Cardinal might well conclude that, like Giff, he values country life more than all that other stuff. I am only arguing that a high profile isn't necessarily a "problem" in meeting potential mates.

 

[jordanb]

Yeah Cardnal, take the job in Portland. ;-)

 

[Richmond Jake]

... It would certainly be putting me on the track to future jobs in top management....

If this is your career goal, I say go for it.

 

[giff57]

Where I see high profile as a problem is that I would feel that I would have to filter any interest and decide if she wanted me or my high profile. Or maybe I don't know what I am talking about, I'm not exactly an expert in the mate selection process after all.

 

[Gedunker]

Careers are like women: when you don't have one, you can't get one and when you have one, better ones are always coming around.

Is there any way to have both the job and the rural lifestyle -- a weekend country house, perhaps?

 

[Michele Zone]

Where I see high profile as a problem is that I would feel that I would have to filter any interest and decide if she wanted me or my high profile. Or maybe I don't know what I am talking about, I'm not exactly an expert in the mate selection process after all.

Yeah, Giff, try that line on someone else. You married a woman 17 years younger than you. I am sure you have Some Clue. :-D

I have some expertise in gifted issues -- particularly how that effects folks socially, emotionally, and psychologically (as people). I have managed to raise two very grounded and very well-adjusted gifted kids, one of whom has multiple handicaps. My sister took her daughter to the Gifted Development Center in Denver earlier this year. Her daughter tested as profoundly gifted (180+ or 200+ IQ) and with some mild handicaps. She also tested as having very good self esteem. My sister was told that they NEVER see kids like that with such good self-esteem. My sister gives me some of the credit in helping guide her in how to deal with raising a child with such issues. Her daughter and my oldest son are like "two peas in a pod", in spite of an age difference of about 7 1/2 years. He also has an excellent sense of self, without being either arrogant or thinking he is "worthless" or bad -- and he knows full well that he is both profoundly gifted and has multiple handicaps. Nor did he start out with good self esteem. Removing him from public school is probably preventing "another Columbine". The longer he was in school, the more he became suicidally depressed and he was having more and more violent fantasies of revenge against the school. So I think I have some idea of how to guide someone in dealing with the social and emotional consequences of being "too smart".

If Cardinal can genuinely handle the challenging job and if it suits him personally, he may find himself more at ease socially as well. I am much more socially comfortable now that I have done graduate level work. I spent most of my life lonely and miserable and unable to find real friends -- folks who could give as well as get. I spent a lot of time feeling used and walked on. Gifted kids are typically raised with the totally sick attitude that their Gifts are public property and SHOULD benefit society as a whole BUT should NOT benefit the child. If the child benefits from their own innate abilities, they are labeled "selfish" and "greedy". (Think of how people talk about Bill Gates.)

This forum is really NOT the place to go into the long explanation of the social dynamics involved and the psychological and social effects on the person who is on the receiving end. The short version comes down to: Cardinal is almost certainly ALREADY coping with women who want to use him and who have little to offer him beyond sex. Besides, if a few women blatantly throw themselves at him because he has a high status job, it might repair some of the damage to his self image caused by being a bachelor for so long. He is smart enough that I am sure he will eventually figure out which women are just taking him for a ride. When he gets tired of the ride and some of his deficit of human and emotional needs have been met, he will be in a better position for meeting Ms. Right. For one thing, he won't be looking so hard. And if he decides that he really wants to fulfill his fantasy of being surrounded by bikini clad babes -- hey, that takes money. :-D

 

[sisterceleste]

Sometimes you have to use your gut feelings. I actually turned down a fantastic job offer once on Sanibel Island, very early in my planning days. Could not figure out why I turned it down. But I had a good job and I liked where I was at that time. Turned out I met my husband a couple of months later and if I had moved to Sanibel, I would never have met him. So for me the big fish that got away...well it was ok, my life took a different turn and I have never regretted it.

 

[Zoning Goddess]

Sometimes you have to use your gut feelings. .

What she said.

Also agree with MZ that you would have a much better social life when you move onwards and upwards into a more urban area.

 

[Chet]

Folks, folks, folks.... Cardinal is a short drive from Madison. Dont sell the night and dating life short. Oh wait... I just remembered how OLD you are! :-c Just kidding.

Cardinal, hear them out. Take the chance to hear what they have to say. Its good to hear that things are turning around where you're at.... but what will one more election cycle bring? You know our state budget situation is right back where it was this time last year. What are the chances of a reprisal? What will the next city admin be like?

(You know I was in the same boat last year but I took the offer given to me).

 

[Rem]

Cardinal I see they are offering you the opportunity to bring someone with you to check out the new City. I'll give you a slab of Hahn Premium long necks and the complete collection of Kylie Minogue CD's if you nominate me. They didn't say it had to be someone from your own town, or someone that you know did they?

Sounds to me like you are tempted and that if you don't explore the opportunity (at least) you will cut yourself up wondering what might have been.

..... I, personally, doubt that taking a high profile position would hinder his chances of finding a viable candidate for a mate......Cardinal shouldn't do anything that does not fulfill him, personally, in hopes of finding a mate. Being himself is the best way to find someone who is a good match for him.

LOL - I have David Attenborough whispering your post in my head now. I see MZ crouched behind some pampas grass with Cardinal grazing within a few metres .... any moment he could charge .... preparing for the annual rut .... lets hope the wind doesn't change to give away our presence ... this magnificent beast will soon have to choose a mate, but before he has any chance of success he may have to prove he is the dominant male ....

 

[SW MI Planner]

I agree with Chet - see what they have to offer. I think now is the perfect time to take a new job. Once you have a family, it's a lot harder to pick up and start over somewhere else.

 

[Repo Man]

I agree with those who want you to at least hear them out. Take the free trip out there and see if you can squeeze an extra day or two out of them so you can check out the City. Who knows, you may love it even though Wisconsin is a tough place to leave, especially now that it is warm out.

 

[mendelman]

I agree with Chet - see what they have to offer.

Dittos from me.

 

[PlannerByDay]

Don't overlook this one.

Will the new job cut into the amount of time you have to post on Cyburbia? ;-)

Actually, if you have ants in you pants and want to move on, even a little bit, go out there and see what they have to offer?

 

[JNL]

Short answer: If you actually want to ever have any hope of marrying, leave town now. If you like being a perpetual bachelor, keep thinking about what is great about the rural town with no women to date. (I am assuming "higher cost of living = more population in the area" ..ie. it is a larger community.)

Does that help?

What the...? You make him sound desperate. There is no reference to "finding a mate" in Cardinal's question B-)

Cardinal - do you already have a gut feeling about this decision? Perhaps you could try imagining your life 6 months down the track, in the 2 scenarios. Obviously, no one knows what is around the corner, but how would the lifestyles compare? Not everyone finds happiness and well-being in the same way - maybe big city life isn't for you.

 

[Chet]

Cardinal LOL - I have David Attenborough whispering your post in my head now. I see MZ crouched behind some pampas grass with Cardinal grazing within a few metres .... any moment he could charge .... preparing for the annual rut .... lets hope the wind doesn't change to give away our presence ... this magnificent beast will soon have to choose a mate, but before he has any chance of success he may have to prove he is the dominant male ....

ANNUAL Rut?! Maybe you don't know Cardinal as well as some of us! LOL 8-!

 

[Michele Zone]

What the...? You make him sound desperate. There is no reference to "finding a mate" in Cardinal's question B-)

Not everyone finds happiness and well-being in the same way - maybe big city life isn't for you.

He has said many times that he hasn't had the best of luck in the dating game and that he wishes it were different. I believe that his rural location is a factor. No, he didn't mention "finding a mate" in his question. But he did indicate he wanted help in rethinking it. If he thought that he had already thought of "everything", I don't imagine he would have posted his question here. Therefore, I feel no obligation to stick to just the points he specifically brought up.

Cardinal has proven on many occasions that he is perfectly capable of telling me how thoroughly he disagrees with my point of view. And I have made it clear that I don't pretend to know whether he would prefer big city life or a more rural life. I have elaborated upon my initial comments at some length in two previous posts and I have no desire to hijack Cardinal's thread. I feel confident that if he wanted to hear more about my views, he would ask me -- either publically or privately.

The history that Cardinal and I have of seeing things differently does not appear to have bred any animosity between us. I hold him in high regard and he has generally treated me respectfully and equitably. However, I do wonder if you have some beef with me. You seem to take a lot of my comments in the worst possible way. If you have something to discuss with me, I would prefer that you contact me privately. Otherwise, please stop taking potshots at me. Others have managed to indicate varying degrees of agreement or disagreement without making it sound like a personal attack.

 

[Budgie]

Cardinal,

I don't know you well enough to offer any help.

Personally, I worked my way up the ladder to a highly respected coast to coast consulting firm with direct ties to one of the most respected land use law firms in the country. Once I got there, I realized that it was not for me. I thrive local contact and the personal/professional relationships that come with being a big fish in a small pond. I feel that my mix of talent (am I bragging on myself?) is better suited to making change in the community which I am a part of. I took a $15k a year cut to take the job I'm at. Money is not everything and I don't regret my move. I'm in it for the long haul. Some would say I'm settling ..... I say that I've found my home. Now if I could just get my new squeeze to dump her worthless leach of a boyfriend. Hey, it's a new role --- Homewrecker !!!!!!!!!!!

If any of this makes sense to you -- seek professional intervention immediately. Remeber, may the force be with you -- always.

 

[SW MI Planner]

Now if I could just get my new squeeze to dump her worthless leach of a boyfriend. Hey, it's a new role --- Homewrecker !!!!!!!!!!!

OOH! THat sounds like a thread for the FAC :-D

 

[spatialmongrel]

It sure sounds like Portland to me. I say GO FOR IT. Me, I'm trapped in a town of 85,000, and every woman in it seems to be married and/or with multiple children. Generally, the husbands/boyfriends are weird-looking rednecks with pickup trucks, and I don't feel like risking my life by stealing their girlfriends. Maybe it's the same with you, who knows. I empathize with your small town lack of love life, and definently enocurage you, for the sake of your sanity, to head for the bright lights. Again, things are good now, but you know they haven't been in the past - and you never know what the next election will bring. You've done your time and done your best - maybe it's time now to think about your own needs rather then the good of the town.

But hey, that's my opinion. I'd go to Portland in a flash,

 

[Cardinal]

LOL! Just about any thread on Cyburbia can turn to sex. As Chet says, Madison isn't far away. I have not dated every available woman in that city, and I have not even started on Milwaukee yet. No, the problem isn't getting dates, but rather the quality of the dates. It has been catch-and-release for some time here. I haven't found a trophy yet, but there have been a handful I wouldn't have minded mounting. Would my prospects be any better in this new location? I suppose the pool is a little larger, but I don't see it as the main issue.

It looks like I will be getting an offer. My decision really has to focus on a few things, including whether the new job suits me, whether the cost of living differential can be surmounted, whether I really want to leave here (or even Wisconsin), what other prospects I may have here down the road (most likely consulting), and things like that.

 

[Lee Nellis]

If you're comfortable where you are, its probably time to change.

 

[donk]

If you've been applying/looking for a new job, you already know the answer. Even with the positive changes in your town, it sounds like it may be time for something new.

 

[Cardinal]

If you've been applying/looking for a new job, you already know the answer. Even with the positive changes in your town, it sounds like it may be time for something new.

It is starting to look that way. This is a nice city, and there may be some things going on that I am excited about, but what about one or two years from now? Will I be getting bored again? I will be going back to the other city to check it out in greater depth.

 

[Glasshouse]

Look at the bright side, the offer could have come from Cleveland.

Bob