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Senior Housing Land Use Description

Messages
24
Points
2
Does anyone have a land use designation that exclusively identifies senior housing? Is so, could I have the text?

Anti-Planner Movement
 

Cardinal

Cyburbian
Messages
10,078
Points
33
NHP, that is an interesting approach, although I am not sure I would like the development resulting from your regulation. I wonder if something like this could be better integrated into a neighborhood fabric.

I think this whole idea of special considerations for an elderly population raises some questions for me. Isn't this really a form of discrimination? What if we were to try to create "family housing districts" in an effort to keep out the college kids? How would that be different?
 

Habanero

Cyburbian
Messages
3,241
Points
27
We allow senior developments, such as retirement communities and senior care facilities, however we would not designate it as it's own land use. If it was in home adult care that did not comply with our definition of family we would require a Use Permit, if they did comply we wouldn't require anything. If it was an adult care home on a commercial scale it would have to locate accordingly. If it was a retirement community it would be able to locate in our residential areas.
 

Jeff

Cyburbian
Messages
4,161
Points
27
The land use of any age-restricted type community is residential. You aren't going to change that.

However, alot of places around here incorporate it in some form of overlay zoning. We've been through this a million times before haven't we?
 

nerudite

Cyburbian
Messages
6,544
Points
29
Michael Stumpf said:
What if we were to try to create "family housing districts" in an effort to keep out the college kids? How would that be different?
In the States, the only population you can really set to the side and adopt residency restrictions for are seniors. I was surprised (when trying to find my first apartment up here) that in Canada they can restrict whole developments for adults only, target families only, seniors only... there really is no law up here that says you can't restrict certain general groups.

Sorry, I couldn't provide any more info for you APM... I don't think many jurisdictions make separate land use districts for Senior Housing either here or in the States.
 

donk

Cyburbian
Messages
6,970
Points
29
Actually, Nerudite if someone decided to fight the developer/city with respect to age discrimination they possibly could and may win depending on the reasonableness of the restrictions and enabling legislation the By-law was adopted under.

From a recent appeal (Provincial Planning and Assessment Appeal Board) here in NB

"The Charter prohibits discrimination on the basis of race, national or ethnic origin, colour, religion, sex, age or mental or physical disability.

The Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms guarantees the rightts and freedoms set out in it subject only to such reasonable limits prescribed by law as can be demonstrablyjustified in a free and democratic society."

This appeal went on to say that you may not create a class of users but you may create a class of uses. In the case of seniors housing the class of use would need to be specified so as to not create a special user class, unless empowered by legislation or policy and unless the discrimation used to create the user class is fair and reasonable and does not unduly remove another parties ability to seek a comparable service.

I hope that is clear, it is easy to understand, but hard to explain.

If anyone wants a copy of this appeal PM me and we can organize something.
 
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NHPlanner

Forums Administrator & Gallery Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
9,860
Points
38
Michael Stumpf said:
NHP, that is an interesting approach, although I am not sure I would like the development resulting from your regulation. I wonder if something like this could be better integrated into a neighborhood fabric.

I think this whole idea of special considerations for an elderly population raises some questions for me. Isn't this really a form of discrimination? What if we were to try to create "family housing districts" in an effort to keep out the college kids? How would that be different?
It's the only type of housing discrimination allowed in the US....and it's incredibly popular with developers and communities, since there aren't school aged kids coming out of the developments. Our town council actually got the town to pass a $2.9 million bond to get a developer to convert a multi-family project to age restricted elderly housing, and had the numbers to back up the cost savings to the town over the life of the bond. NH depends entirely on local property taxes for education funding, so school population growth is of big concern around here.
 

nerudite

Cyburbian
Messages
6,544
Points
29
donk said:
Actually, Nerudite if someone decided to fight the developer/city with respect to age discrimination they possibly could and may win depending on the reasonableness of the restrictions and enabling legislation teh By-law was adopted under.
Wow... I wish I had known this when I found this awesome apartment a year ago, but they wouldn't let the kids visit on the weekends. I found it so puzzling coming from the States and I didn't know any better (until this morning that is). Thanks donk. :)
 

donk

Cyburbian
Messages
6,970
Points
29
If I remember correctly ther was a case in Toronto about 15-18 years ago about this and the property owner lost and had to admit children to an adults only building. There is nothing to say that it cannot affect your rental rate and damage deposit though. (reasonableness)
 

Seabishop

Cyburbian
Messages
3,838
Points
25
Michael Stumpf said:
NHP, that is an interesting approach, although I am not sure I would like the development resulting from your regulation. I wonder if something like this could be better integrated into a neighborhood fabric.

I think this whole idea of special considerations for an elderly population raises some questions for me. Isn't this really a form of discrimination? What if we were to try to create "family housing districts" in an effort to keep out the college kids? How would that be different?
I agree. I don't think those over 55 are so special that they deserve their own exclusive neighborhoods. I think housing should be built that will appeal to aging baby boomers but not at the expense of everyone else. Its hard enough for working families to find affordable housing without a large percentage of new developments being built for "mature" individuals to appease school districts.
 

Jeff

Cyburbian
Messages
4,161
Points
27
Seabishop said:


I agree. I don't think those over 55 are so special that they deserve their own exclusive neighborhoods. I think housing should be built that will appeal to aging baby boomers but not at the expense of everyone else. Its hard enough for working families to find affordable housing without a large percentage of new developments being built for "mature" individuals to appease school districts.
Around here what alot of the twps are doing is the overlay concept, where it just isn't economically feasible to build SFDs when the overlay will let you pop in twice as many units.

I don't think this is exclusionary housing at all. Most of them that I see (and build) are "gated" communities with really no dependence on the twp in most cases. Sometimes we will tie into a sewer or water plant, but we're usually doubling the size of it at the same time.

The dwellings are usually deed restricted with some language that states that 1 owner must be over 55 and children under 18 will not be in the house more than 2 cumulative weeks per year....
 

Cardinal

Cyburbian
Messages
10,078
Points
33
I could go on about the whole senior thing. Senior citizen discounts, for instance. What if I were to propose a 10% discount because I am in my 30's? or a male? or for that matter, a blond-haired, blue-eyed person with German ancestry? The law may permit it, but that does not make it right.

Seniors certainly are easier to permit than other users, whether it is because the (appear to) cost less, or they (appear to) cause less problems.

Traffic a problem? Permit seniors, they drive less and aren't a problem. (Except the ones who drive down a park path thinking it is a road, not all that long after another incident when they hit a pedestrian.)

Schools cost too much? Permit seniors, they don't have kids. (Only they don't care much about schools anymore and overwhelmingly vote against the referendum to raise taxes to fund school improvements. Hey, they didn't have computers when they were kids, and they did just fine working at the raincoat factory, at least until it closed.)

Problem neighbors? Permit seniors, they are a stable influence. (Oh, yeah, seniors look out for the community. Don't you just love it when they get on television and start talking about how things went to hell after the blacks caused all of the problems in the 70's, and how police need to start cracking down on the Mexicans?)

Maybe they aren't all that bad, but seniors have their problems too. Creating special rules for them is discrimination, and not for anyone's benefit but their own (and the ever-evil developer).
 

donk

Cyburbian
Messages
6,970
Points
29
On the education front. The taxes they pay for the education of today's kids is actually the ongoing repayment of their and their familiy's education as well as an investment in the pension cheques they receive each month. (better educated people = higher paid people = higher income tax , except in NH = higher pension contributions, at least here = better benefits)

On the transportation front, while they may drive less they drive a lot slower and therefore take longer to get places, therefore causing congestion and increasing the wear on the road and costing the economy.

What about health care? Seniors do cost a lot more on this matter and place a greater strain on the medical system then other age groups.
 

Seabishop

Cyburbian
Messages
3,838
Points
25
If senior discounts were tied into fixed incomes they'd make sense to me. Think about all the successful pensioners, CEO's, land developers, and even town officials who are rolling in the dough over the age of 55 while the young dad with 3 jobs pays full price. But can you imagine being the politician who attacks senior developments and discounts - your opponent would immediately break out his lock-box.
 
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