• Cyburbia is a friendly big tent, where we share our experiences and thoughts about urban planning practice, the built environment, planning adjacent topics, and anything else that comes to mind. No ads, no spam, and it's free. It's easy to join!

Spaghetti SUV?

El Feo

Cyburbian
Messages
674
Points
19
jordanb said:
How many people do fashionable shoes decapitate every year again?

It happens, and when it does, it can be the perfect crime.

On the other hand, I do see your point - those nefarious SUVs, with all their axes, swords and guillotines - damn 'em!
 

Runner

Cyburbian
Messages
566
Points
17
El Feo said:
Is the $60,000 Lexus any less objectionable by this standard than any SUV?

That's because others are judging it by different standards. Personally my problem with SUV are:
  • Poor fuel efficiency
  • Size (length, width, height, and weight)

Size is especially a problematic when you consider that the world now has to be supersized to keep up with these behemoths. Although some have tried, supersizing pedestrians and cyclists has proven a poor choice.

Fuel inefficiency keeps us in the middle east.

Yes, some SUVs may compete favorably to some sedans but we need to look at the overall record of each fleet. Height remains an issue.
 

H

Cyburbian
Messages
2,846
Points
24
El Feo said:
Is the $60,000 Lexus any less objectionable by this standard than any SUV? I think it's more so - nobody really needs a luxury sedan. On the other hand, one could argue that they need towing capacity and cargo room on a regular enough basis that it's justifiable, even if they're not used on a daily basis.


No, but I just don’t have the same opinion (and that’s what it is) about luxury cars. I like luxury cars, maybe one day I will own one like dear ole dad, but I just see luxury SUVs as silly. Plus, plus a Lexus gets pretty good gas mileage, relatively speaking.

If you tow or haul cargo then it is justified, but most people don’t.
 

H

Cyburbian
Messages
2,846
Points
24
jordanb said:
How many people do fashionable shoes decapitate every year again?

Nor do I like fasionable shoe.... I like comfortable shoes.

I feel sorry for people who blow there weekly paychecks on fashion. It hapens so much here in Florida, it is just really too have a 300 shooes and behind on your car payment.

Thats marketing, folks....
 

El Feo

Cyburbian
Messages
674
Points
19
Huston said:
No, but I just don’t have the same opinion (and that’s what it is) about luxury cars. I like luxury cars, maybe one day I will own one like dear ole dad, but I just see luxury SUVs as silly. Plus, plus a Lexus gets pretty good gas mileage, relatively speaking.

If you tow or haul cargo then it is justified, but most people don’t.

Look, opinions are all any of these posts are, so no need to elaborate on that. I like luxury cars too. Also like SUVs, though I don't own one and probably never will.

As far as relative gas mileage, luxury cars suck compared to hybrids, but if you can afford the gas for the luxury car, I'm not gonna preach that you shouldn't have it. That's my only point.
 

El Feo

Cyburbian
Messages
674
Points
19
Runner said:
Fuel inefficiency keeps us in the middle east.

I think nutjob Wahhabists that fly planes into buildings have something to do with that. That's another thread, I suppose.
 

gkmo62u

Cyburbian
Messages
1,046
Points
24
I think now is a good time to tell all my friends here that its down to either:

GMC Tahoe

Chevy Yukon

Ford expedition

O% financing

Wife hates the minivan image, 2 dogs, 3 kids.

Runner: I want a big SUV.
 

Runner

Cyburbian
Messages
566
Points
17
El Feo said:
but if you can afford the gas for the luxury car, I'm not gonna preach that you shouldn't have it.

OK, I will.
Just because you have the money does not mean it's OK to pollute the planet, keep our military in the middle east, and make the urban experience less pleasant for everyone outside of your little "It's all about me" world.

Yes,
Given a choice between the two extremes:
1) A world filled with SUVs.
or
2) Private ownership of automobiles outlawed.
I'd take #2 in a heartbeat.

But why do we have to make such pigs of ourselves? How about just moderating the automobile so it is less disagreeable?

I guess I know the answer:
No, it's all about me!
 

El Feo

Cyburbian
Messages
674
Points
19
G - ALWAYS go with the Ford (or Lincoln, Mercury, Mazda, Volvo, Jaguar, Land Rover, Aston Martin or Nissan). You get your SUV, and it helps my portfolio.
 

El Feo

Cyburbian
Messages
674
Points
19
Runner said:
OK, I will.
Just because you have the money does not mean it's OK to pollute the planet, keep our military in the middle east, and make the urban experience less pleasant for everyone outside of your little "It's all about me" world.

On the other hand, it's apparently all right to rob somebody else of the happiness that a new SUV brings them. But that's a different, acceptable "It's all about me" world.

I'm sorry, sometimes I'm "all about ooooooooiiiiiiiiillllllllll."
 

Runner

Cyburbian
Messages
566
Points
17
gkmo62u said:
I want a big SUV.

OK, I don't like it but at least we don't hear a lot of dribble as to how you need one for a whole litany of ridiculous reasons.
 

Runner

Cyburbian
Messages
566
Points
17
El Feo said:
rob somebody else of the happiness that a new SUV brings them.

Now that's ridiculous!

Madison Avenue you are so good at what you do!
 

El Feo

Cyburbian
Messages
674
Points
19
Runner said:
Now that's ridiculous!

What? You never had a new car you were happy and excited about?

Talk about ridiculous!

Madison Avenue you are so good at what you do!

Ah, yes, must be the mind control juices pumped through the water pipes by the Madison Avenue cabal. I think they have reciprocal membership with the Neocons.

Oliver Stone you are so good at what you do!
 

gkmo62u

Cyburbian
Messages
1,046
Points
24
Runner:

I love the way you turn a phrase, it really gives you away. "Private ownership of automobiles outlawed"

I can only assume from your perspective that means two utterly silly options:

1) The Government would all own the vehicles which would be just one more control it has on your life or;

2) Some collective would own them, like the workers collective or the Greens



I do the room/carrying capacity as well. That is just not made up.


Its so odd to me how the left goes on these benders.



El feo--sorry I missed you and wife down here--kids and naps messed up our schedule
 

El Feo

Cyburbian
Messages
674
Points
19
gkmo62u said:
El feo--sorry I missed you and wife down here--kids and naps messed up our schedule

No problem - sorry we missed you guys too. We will catch you this Fall hopefully.
 

H

Cyburbian
Messages
2,846
Points
24
El Feo said:
Look, opinions are all any of these posts are...

True dat.

and on that note,

"SUVs Suck!"

okay, thats out of my system...

where's my lexus?

I know this post is childish, but it is after 5 on Friday, I am stir crazy….;)
 

Runner

Cyburbian
Messages
566
Points
17
gkmo62u said:
I can only assume from your perspective that means two utterly silly options:
1) The Government would all own the vehicles which would be just one more control it has on your life or;
2) Some collective would own them, like the workers collective or the Greens

Ah, no and no.
But if one were to read two sentences more one would see I would advocate neither of the extremes but rather a moderation of automobiles. My comment was in response to a comment by another poster about outlawing automobiles (which I think has now been edited). This moderation is actually already occurring as "crossover vehicles" (i.e. station wagons) arrive/reappear and vehicles such as the Ford Excursion have been scheduled for final production.
 

Cardinal

Cyburbian
Messages
10,069
Points
34
I guess I'd have to say I would like to live in a world with fewer SUV's. My preference comes from three concerns:

1) While I am not one of those fools (sorry fools) who rants about global warming and the like, I do recognize that auto emissions are a significant source of pollution, and light trucks and SUV's are worse than many other vehicles in this area.

2) SUV's are potentially more dangerous to other, smaller vehicles on the road. This can be obvious, as in a collision between a Ford Expedition and a Mini Cooper. In other cases, it might be the difficulty other drivers have in seeing through or around these taller vehicles.

3) As I alluded to before, many of the drivers of SUV's do not understand that their vehicles do not handle like a typical car, and that 4WD does not mean that they will stick to the pavement under any conditions. I am not kidding when I say that on my winter drives between Madison and home, I see more SUV's off in the ditch than I do cars. A large number also seem to have Illinoise plates. Go figure.

Still, I am not about to advoocate for the guv'mint to begin telling people what they can drive. A good compromise position might be for the guv'mint to set and stick to stricter emissions goals, and to ban Illinois drivers from Wisconsin roads.
 

BKM

Cyburbian
Messages
6,461
Points
29
Runner:

Were you born in Texas? I'm surprised they haven't torched your house or something.

(Just kidding, I know there are liberals in Texas. Molly Ivins and Jim Hightower are hilarious)

I guess my take on this is that no, Madison Avenue doesn't control the world, but it certainly helps establish some cultural mores. Hence, large, macho SUVs are "cool" and "rugged." The "left" or the "wacky environmentalists" have just as much right to counter such "propaganda" with (often shrill) attacks and making fun of rugged soccer moms drivin' the H2 to the Mall. And, among the Volvo/bohemian bourgeoisie, maybe that kind of "advertising" is beginning to work-hence the Volvo crossover vehicles.

gkmo6, the problem I have is the lack of a level playing field. Why should passenger cars have to meet pollution standards, but the suburban mom in question gets an exemption based on the myth that these uberwagens are driven by farmers and contractors?
 

Zoning Goddess

Cyburbian
Messages
13,843
Points
40
Michael Stumpf said:
Just think of all the poor, innocent cows whose lives are cut short every year. Won't somebody please think of the cows!

I know you are concerned about fashionable shoes taking cows lives. However, I have also wiped one out in a small sedan, going 60 mph thru Groveland FL late one night. It caused $900 damage to my car. Bet if I'd been in a high-ridin' SUV, I'd have skated right over that cow!
 

Runner

Cyburbian
Messages
566
Points
17
Obviously this non-native Texan :) would define a level playing field as one that requires registration fees according to a schedule based on:
  • Emissions
  • Fuel Consumption
  • Weight
  • Volume
  • Height

Low registration fees, lax emission requirements, and tax rebates for behemoth SUVs are all nonsense.
 

Chet

Cyburbian Emeritus
Messages
10,589
Points
34
Runner said:
Obviously this non-native Texan :) would define a level playing field as one that requires registration fees according to a schedule based on:
  • Emissions
  • Fuel Consumption
  • Weight
  • Volume
  • Height

Low registration fees, lax emission requirements, and tax rebates for behemoth SUVs are all nonsense.

As an SUV driver I would supprt that once the federal income tax codes are amended to repeal the incentives to own. Until then, why add a disincentive to an incentive?
 

Runner

Cyburbian
Messages
566
Points
17
Chet said:
As an SUV driver I would supprt that once the federal income tax codes are amended to repeal the incentives to own. Until then, why add a disincentive to an incentive?

I guess I actually meant tax deduction. So I think we are in agreement.
 

Chet

Cyburbian Emeritus
Messages
10,589
Points
34
Runner said:
I guess I actually meant tax deduction. So I think we are in agreement.

Yes we are. Gee Look at that -- Cyburbanites debating and agreeing.

*looks around for a certain chicagoan* ;)
 

el Guapo

Capitalist
Messages
5,986
Points
31
Re: I'll have the station wagon instead, please

mendelman said:
Might be off topic, but I think anyone can get the same utility froma good old station wagon. It's a shame that the SUV and their crossover offspring have almost effectively killed the full size station wagon.

This poster is making sense! Viva la Wagon!
 

BKM

Cyburbian
Messages
6,461
Points
29
H2s

From a commie-pinko website:

"Y'know that TV ad where a giant yellow Hummer goes bouncing along some god-forsaken terrain?

That reminded me of something... I couldn't put my finger on it... I knew I'd seen something like that before... maybe in my childhood...

Wait -- long, yellow, oddly squarish, stiff suspension... I've got it!
It's the school bus that used to go by when I was a kid!!!

All you gotta do is paint "Willoughby-Eastlake Public School System" on the side and move the doors around a little, and it's pretty much exactly right. Maybe throw a couple of smokestacks in the distance and some grotty bits of exhaust-caked snow on the ground, and you've got it.

Sport-freakin'-school-buses.
 

Jeff

Cyburbian
Messages
4,159
Points
27
Fo shizzle my nizzle ....

Its all 'bout da BLING BLING ....

As soon as the rest of the world figures this out we'll all be better off.

H2's just aren't even BLING BLING anymore, they're everywhere, and you can lease one for like $500 a mo now so whats da point?
 

donk

Cyburbian
Messages
6,961
Points
31
saw teh new porsche cayenne on teh street in toronto, not really impressed. Not SUV, not porsche, just conspicuous consumption run amok.
 

Jessie-J

Cyburbian
Messages
384
Points
12
I live accross the street from a porsche dealership, those Cayenne's are SO ugly. I can't imagine an uglier vehicle. It's like the hood is a porshe and the a$$ is a bus.
 

plankton

Cyburbian
Messages
750
Points
21
Nothing more american than driving that POS to McD for some freedom fries. Gimme 60mpg or give me death!
 
Top