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The NEVERENDING Political Discussion Thread

Doohickie

Cyburbian
Messages
2,804
Points
38
in the majority of cases they likely have been coincidences
I disagree. I think they are exactly what they seem to be. They are dog whistle calls to his base and nothing else. At this point his base is the radical right tin foil hat conspiracy believing white power Nazis. That's all he cares about. His announcement about creating a "National Garden of American Heroes" is nothing more than a pandering to white nationalists who see the Black Lives Matter movement stripping away the few remaining claims of their legitimacy. It really is becoming a race war.
 

Linda_D

Cyburbian
Messages
1,745
Points
20
I'm not impressed with this woman's supposed "fear" for her personal safety. It seems to me that she felt that she was due a personal police escort out of a traffic jam caused by the protests. There were no other videos/reports of the protestors jumping on other cars driving through the protest area, although there was video of protestors simply surrounding a police car sitting in what appears to be a parking lot.

Moreover, in the video, she's pulled over on the side of the street and out of her car confronting protestors while the cars that are on the street are slowly driving by. If she was as concerned for her "personal safety" as she claims she was, why did she pull over and get out of her car rather keep in line and slowly moving along with traffic? Hers aren't the actions of somebody fearful of their personal safety but of somebody looking for a confrontation. While there's video of a protestor on her car when it's pull off the street, there's no indication that the protestor jumped on her car while it was in the line of traffic.

As for the "violence" by the protestors, she's displaying as much as any of the protestors. There's no sound on the video so we don't know what was being said by her or the protestors, but from Ms Newton's body language she was verbally giving as good as she got.

At best, she was somebody who felt that she was so "special" that the police should be her personal escort service out of a traffic jam. At worse, this was a staged event intended to inflame sentiment against people protesting for police reform.
 

JNA

Cyburbian Plus
Messages
25,656
Points
60
Really now -

Kanye tweets he's running for president
 

Doohickie

Cyburbian
Messages
2,804
Points
38
I just had a nice conversation on Facebook with my* congressman about R&B music.

*I'm not actually in his district by just a few blocks, but I've met him several times and I feel he represents me in Washington better than my actual congresswoman.
 

Hink

OH....IO
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
15,707
Points
50
If you were the lady in the white SUV, how would you have handled the situation? What would you have done if a group of protesters stopped your vehicle from moving forward and surrounded it?


I feel like a lot people play this game, what if. Unfortunately there are been a lot of situations that weren't great, but wondering what would you have done really is a pointless effort. What does it matter?

I feel like a lot of time stuff like this is brought up to try and show how unruly or unsafe the protests are. Is that what you are insinuating or do you just really want to know what people would have done if they were in that exact situation at that exact time?

If I was in that exact situation, at that exact time, I would have sat in my car and called the police. Or I would have walked away and hoped my car was not ruined when I came back. Yelling at those kids does nothing to make the situation get better. But honestly, I wouldn't have been in that situation, as I am sure there is more to that story that I couldn't understand.
 

Planit

Cyburbian
Messages
12,985
Points
53
Really now -

Kanye tweets he's running for president

How many of us think this might be tRump's doing to try and split the black vote. Remember, Kanye loves tRump.
 

Hink

OH....IO
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
15,707
Points
50
How many of us think this might be tRump's doing to try and split the black vote. Remember, Kanye loves tRump.
I see it hurting him more than helping him. I don't think anyone thinks that he would make a good president, or has any moral compass that isn't selfishly driven. Why would you pick him instead of Trump if you are into the self-loving megalomaniac for President camp?
 

gtpeach

Cyburbian
Messages
2,082
Points
21
Ally Henny, a Black activist I follow on Facebook who does NOT support Kanye for President, made what I thought was an important observation about his announcement. Note that her comments are largely directed at those that support Trump, but think a Kanye run is ridiculous:


I just want to remind y’all that Kanye is a self-made BILLIONAIRE who is not only a successful entertainer, but also a business man with a successful clothing line who has been married exactly once and has never filed for bankruptcy. Kanye made his money through talent and achievement and not through a “small loan” from a relative.

Kim Kardashian West came from a family with money and was able to parlay the release of her sex tape into reality TV success. Mrs. West is a multi-millionaire in her own right, and is following in her father’s footsteps to become a lawyer. She has already been working on the realm of advocacy for people treated unjustly by the justice system. Although she comes from a family of means, Mrs. West stewarded the wealth she was given well and became a sharp business woman with a successful line of beauty products.

Oh, and Kanye and Kim are professing Christians. Kim, whose family has been involved with church planing since she was young, was the one who is instrumental in Kanye’s return to faith.

So, if you have issues with Kanye potentially being president, but thought that Donald Trump was AOK, your issue probably isn’t with his “lack of experience” or how he makes his money, but because he’s Black. I mean, it’s fine if you don’t want Kanye to be president (after you make an informed decision based on his platform and not just a visceral reaction).

I mean, Kanye more accurately represents the self-made, “pull yourself up from the bootstraps” American Dream story that y’all love than Donald Trump does.

I really don’t give a heck if y’all want to vote for Kanye or not, but I want y’all to examine y’all’s visceral reactions...ESPECIALLY if you were a Trump supporter because in terms of experience and such there are a lot of similarities. I want y’all to examine yourselves, because I bet you’ll find some bias and racism there. What made Trump seem like a viable candidate, but y’all want to dismiss Kanye prima facie.

So imma go ahead and watch some of y’all shift these goal posts and bend and twist like Neo from the Matrix to try to justify why you’re cool with one Billionaire without experience and not the other.

If I stepped on your toes a bit, it’s cool to keep scrolling because I don’t actually care about your response. The point of the exercise was to examine yourself, which is an internal process that I don’t need to be involved in.

Be blessed.

EDIT: I can see from the comments that white fragility is rearing it’s ugly head. Some of y’all are so invested in proving your white innocence that you’re missing the point of this post. I’m not saying that Kanye is a good idea for President by any means. What I’m doing is using the same measuring stick that people used for Trump on Kanye and getting them to examine their biases.

Clearly, it’s also important for those of y’all who oppose Trump and Kanye to also examine your fragility. Actually read what I wrote. This isn’t for you to defend yourself, because this post literally is not about you. But you made it about you and that is something that whiteness does.
 

michaelskis

Cyburbian
Messages
20,055
Points
50
I feel like a lot people play this game, what if. Unfortunately there are been a lot of situations that weren't great, but wondering what would you have done really is a pointless effort. What does it matter?

I feel like a lot of time stuff like this is brought up to try and show how unruly or unsafe the protests are. Is that what you are insinuating or do you just really want to know what people would have done if they were in that exact situation at that exact time?

If I was in that exact situation, at that exact time, I would have sat in my car and called the police. Or I would have walked away and hoped my car was not ruined when I came back. Yelling at those kids does nothing to make the situation get better. But honestly, I wouldn't have been in that situation, as I am sure there is more to that story that I couldn't understand.
I am insinuating that I am genuinely curious on what others would do in a situation where you are driving from point A to point B and a group of protesters stop you and prevent you from moving forward. It matters because I was in a similar situation. I was bringing one of my kids to a Dr. Apt in downtown and because of an accident on the main road, I the waze app routed me near one of the protests that was growing. Someone steeped in front of my truck to impede me moving forward. The guy in the vehicle next to me started yelling at them, so they all gathered around his vehicle and I slowly drove off. I was prepared to call the police. I would not have felt that my safety was in jeopardy unless they tried to get into my vehicle.

You say you would not have been in that situation, but this is not an isolated event. Some weeks ago when the protests were moving from location to location and vehicles got caught up in the protests only because they were trying to get from point A to point B and the protest moved into their path. In once case, it caused a slight delay for an ambulance trying to get to someone, but police used teargas to clear the remaining few that were still there.

More so, I am also curious on what is the intent of these people who target vehicles to stop. It is one thing for a road to get blocked because of a critical mass of people, but that is not what is going on here. These folks are taking deliberate action to impede vehicles. This is just one example. Look at all the other locations were everything from local roads to freeways were blocked.
 

luckless pedestrian

Super Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
12,325
Points
52
If we have learned anything fro the Trump Administration we have learned that the application of the business world (or really, any other world) is not a good fit for the Presidency.

I said this to my Republican friends when he was running and I will say it again:

Taking out the emotion and looking at its face for this problem:

Ego-ridden people that are used to everyone doing what they say (not crazy, that's just business) and firing people if they don't do what they are told (high turnover, not great for business, but still, that's your right when you are CEO) are not good at things like:

  • consensus building
  • checks and balances - that is, other people having power that you can't control and they are also watching you
  • democracy in voting, the majority wins - sometimes, you don't get your way
  • compromise positions arising from negotiations - again, not getting your way - though this is a point that I thought maybe a business person would get, but not this guy)
  • not firing people because you don't like them if they are competent in their work (there's a lot of clean-house that happens for sure when there's a new administration but firing your own hires at will is not a good idea)
  • working with countries you may not otherwise like - a basic respect for history (or if you don't have that basic understanding, surrounding yourself with people that do)
  • having to divest and forget about your personal business affairs while in office (this truly is the worst of all of it as most of the poor decisions that have been made are due to this, as well as the ego)
  • surprising to me is the addition of being able to take advice from consultants that is, the Cabinet and the heads of departments and offices - I am surprised because so many Fortune 500's use consultants on a regular basis (hello, Deloitte?) and yet he never took advice from people who were trained and educated in their field and fired them instead - that's another true oddity

so let's all just ixnay on putting in Washington outsiders into the beltway - there is nothing wrong with a career in politics as long as you don't forget your constituents and the constituency needs to pay attention to whom they are voting for - there is nothing helpful about being clueless on your first day as PRESIDENT for heaven's sake, wtf people

I hope we have learned a lesson that CEO's and Presidents are NOT THE SAME THING AT ALL

and the same holds true to entertainers, sorry, most musicians and trained/educated actors are very smart people, geniuses even, but their skills don't translate well either so stop
 

AG74683

Cyburbian
Messages
7,094
Points
39
I see Kayne and Trump as very similar: Malignant narcissists.
I agree, but I think there is a difference between the two. Trump's narcissism is really driven by nothing but his own ego. He never really had to work hard for what he has. He rode the family coattails and that's about it. Sure, he managed to turn the Trump name into a brand, but that's not particularly difficult when you have enough money to throw at it.

Kanye is different. While admittedly his narcissism is also driven by an extreme ego, at least he's earned what he has. That piece that gtpeach posted isn't wrong, he really DID do all those things. He grew up with nothing and is now one of the most well known people on the entire planet. He earned every bit of what he has, and while I really don't care for Kanye as a person, I do respect him, unlike Trump.

NOW, all that said, neither man is fit to be President.

Oh, in other political news, how long does everyone think Ghislaine Maxwell will last in prison? Bet she will die from "suicide" in less than 2 weeks.
 
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Planit

Cyburbian
Messages
12,985
Points
53
Republican Senate Hypocrisy Example of the Day:

Good Senator from Iowa, Joni Ernst said in 2014 that becasue of the Ebola outbreak and 2 deaths in the US, Obama was failed leadership. When asked if tRump showed the same failed leadership with COVID19 deaths at somewhere around 130,000, she said the administration was doing a great job.


I tried to post a link, but it's not working...
 
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TOFB

Cyburbian
Messages
2,458
Points
29
Republican Senate Hypocrisy Example of the Day:

Good Senator from Iowa, Joni Ernst said in 2014 that becasue of the Ebola outbreak and 2 deaths in the US, Obama was failed leadership. When asked if tRump showed the same failed leadership with COVID19 deaths at somewhere around 130,000, she said the administration was doing a great job.



I tried to post a link, but it's not working...
Don't need a link, she is garbage.

And Assley sais he isn't going to the RNC convention because of the 'Rona.

Yay my state.
 

Linda_D

Cyburbian
Messages
1,745
Points
20
I am insinuating that I am genuinely curious on what others would do in a situation where you are driving from point A to point B and a group of protesters stop you and prevent you from moving forward. It matters because I was in a similar situation. I was bringing one of my kids to a Dr. Apt in downtown and because of an accident on the main road, I the waze app routed me near one of the protests that was growing. Someone steeped in front of my truck to impede me moving forward. The guy in the vehicle next to me started yelling at them, so they all gathered around his vehicle and I slowly drove off. I was prepared to call the police. I would not have felt that my safety was in jeopardy unless they tried to get into my vehicle.

You say you would not have been in that situation, but this is not an isolated event. Some weeks ago when the protests were moving from location to location and vehicles got caught up in the protests only because they were trying to get from point A to point B and the protest moved into their path. In once case, it caused a slight delay for an ambulance trying to get to someone, but police used teargas to clear the remaining few that were still there.

More so, I am also curious on what is the intent of these people who target vehicles to stop. It is one thing for a road to get blocked because of a critical mass of people, but that is not what is going on here. These folks are taking deliberate action to impede vehicles. This is just one example. Look at all the other locations were everything from local roads to freeways were blocked.
Was she really stopped randomly in the line of traffic because some protesters felt like stopping traffic or did she, like the guy in the vehicle next you, start the confrontation by yelling at them or making obscene gestures? We only have her version because the video only starts after she's stopped out of traffic. Certainly pulling off the street and stopping made her a target.

For myself, first I'd stay in my car. Secondly, I'd give them a peace sign, and maybe roll down my window, tell them I'm on their side, and give some of the protesters high-fives because I support their cause ... and some empathy goes a long way in defusing tense situations.
 

gtpeach

Cyburbian
Messages
2,082
Points
21
Was she really stopped randomly in the line of traffic because some protesters felt like stopping traffic or did she, like the guy in the vehicle next you, start the confrontation by yelling at them or making obscene gestures? We only have her version because the video only starts after she's stopped out of traffic. Certainly pulling off the street and stopping made her a target.

For myself, first I'd stay in my car. Secondly, I'd give them a peace sign, and maybe roll down my window, tell them I'm on their side, and give some of the protesters high-fives because I support their cause ... and some empathy goes a long way in defusing tense situations.
This is what I was going to say as well. What happens if instead of yelling and escalating the situation, you just rolled down the window and asked them how they were doing? Or even just smile at them. Whether or not you personally support the protests, I think just showing basic human decency may turn that into a much different interaction. It'd at least be worth a try.
 

Hink

OH....IO
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
15,707
Points
50
Trump Twitter said:
They name teams out of STRENGTH, not weakness, but now the Washington Redskins & Cleveland Indians, two fabled sports franchises, look like they are going to be changing their names in order to be politically correct. Indians, like Elizabeth Warren, must be very angry right now!
I look forward to having a President who doesn't speak like this. I picked out a tweet that is sandwiched in between some racist tweets about the "China Virus" too.

I hope if Joe Biden wins that I don't see any social media posts that call out people by name for things that they did or, in the case above, things people said that were probably wrong. Or any posts by Joe himself. Maybe have the WH tweet out policy and schedules and stuff of importance.

Have I said how much I hate social media platforms? ;)
 

Planit

Cyburbian
Messages
12,985
Points
53
^^^The only thing that will stop tRump from tweeting his rants will be his death. He will continue to tweet when he leaves the WH just like he did before he was in the WH.

SAD.
 

Hink

OH....IO
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
15,707
Points
50
^^^The only thing that will stop tRump from tweeting his rants will be his death. He will continue to tweet when he leaves the WH just like he did before he was in the WH.

SAD.
Yet, once he is gone, he will be largely forgotten and ignored. I think his following is out of convenience, not out of respect or support for his leadership style. Even the melty backboned republicans who are not able to stand up for themselves or have their own ideas will ignore him, when their next leader comes forward.

Speaking of next leader, I don't really see anyone on the Republican side right now, that I would say is a thought leader or the next President. There have been a number of people who have tried to get their foot in that door, but have never had the ability to position themselves right...I'm looking at you Paul Ryan, Marco Rubio, John Kasich, Nikki Haley, Tim Scott, and Josh Hawley.

Maybe we will see these people come forward and lead the Republicans to a new age after we move on from whatever time this is for the Republican party. Maybe?
 

Suburb Repairman

moderator in moderation
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
7,402
Points
33
Yet, once he is gone, he will be largely forgotten and ignored. I think his following is out of convenience, not out of respect or support for his leadership style. Even the melty backboned republicans who are not able to stand up for themselves or have their own ideas will ignore him, when their next leader comes forward.

Speaking of next leader, I don't really see anyone on the Republican side right now, that I would say is a thought leader or the next President. There have been a number of people who have tried to get their foot in that door, but have never had the ability to position themselves right...I'm looking at you Paul Ryan, Marco Rubio, John Kasich, Nikki Haley, Tim Scott, and Josh Hawley.

Maybe we will see these people come forward and lead the Republicans to a new age after we move on from whatever time this is for the Republican party. Maybe?
Romney is at least operating in a manner that would allow him to step in as a Lord Protector for the GOP while they reset themselves and clean house. He has his own issues though and shouldn't be viewed as a long-term solution--have him essentially manage the crisis. He's about the only one that has refused to go full sycophant boot-licker on Trump, but he is able to do that in large part because he is independently wealthy and won with an anti-Trump campaign. The Lincoln Project will be the organization of this reset. The GOP doesn't have any thought leaders, and hasn't for quite some time. That is what got them into the Trump mess... "if you don't stand for nothin' then what'll you fall for?"
 

Maister

Chairman of the bored
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
28,414
Points
71
Speaking of next leader, I don't really see anyone on the Republican side right now, that I would say is a thought leader or the next President.
Super depressing thoughts for the week: Jared, Don Jr., Ivanka....
 

AG74683

Cyburbian
Messages
7,094
Points
39
Speaking of next leader, I don't really see anyone on the Republican side right now, that I would say is a thought leader or the next President.
I don't think either side has a true leader right now. I see no one in that pile of dinosaur bones sitting on Capitol Hill that I'd be head over heels for as President. Biden is yet another "best of a bad situation" candidate.
 
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Hink

OH....IO
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
15,707
Points
50
I don't think either side has a true leader right now. I see no one in that pile of dinosaur bones sitting on Capitol Hill that'd I'd be head over heels for as President. Biden is yet another "best of a bad situation" candidate.
I agree generally. We don't have someone who could bridge the gap that is within either party right now. What about Mark Cuban? Someone outside the game?

I think the D's have AOC and Bernie and Warren and the progressive push that is "leading" a lot of their ideas, and the R's have Trump and Cruz maybe? I am not certain other than Trump who is pushing any new ideas within the Republican party. Rand Paul on the libertarian side?

The D's may have some, what some would consider crazy ideas (Green New Deal, Medicare for All, etc.), but they are putting ideas out there. I cannot think of a unique R idea that is pushing forward our country? I don't know that I can put my finger on an R policy that is keeping us even? Border protection maybe? What policy position is being pushed by an R right now that is outside of what we are already doing? Drilling maybe?
 

AG74683

Cyburbian
Messages
7,094
Points
39
I agree generally. We don't have someone who could bridge the gap that is within either party right now. What about Mark Cuban? Someone outside the game?

I think the D's have AOC and Bernie and Warren and the progressive push that is "leading" a lot of their ideas, and the R's have Trump and Cruz maybe? I am not certain other than Trump who is pushing any new ideas within the Republican party. Rand Paul on the libertarian side?

The D's may have some, what some would consider crazy ideas (Green New Deal, Medicare for All, etc.), but they are putting ideas out there. I cannot think of a unique R idea that is pushing forward our country? I don't know that I can put my finger on an R policy that is keeping us even? Border protection maybe? What policy position is being pushed by an R right now that is outside of what we are already doing? Drilling maybe?
Mark Cuban isn't bad, but I just don't know enough about him personally to say he'd be good as a politician. We have already seen what happens when you take a bombastic millionaire and give him the role. I don't want more of the same, although I think in general, Cuban has a better personality than Trump.

AOC, Bernie, and Warren are too left for most of the country. They'll always carry the urban core and major college towns and liberal strongholds, but they will never be able to secure GOP areas and probably won't show well in battleground states. Trump showed that even some liberal strong holds are weak when pressured the right way.

IMO, Trump isn't pushing any new Republican ideas, he's rehashing old ideas that many GOP supporters like, but haven't mentioned in years because it draws too much criticism from others. He's given them the ability to come out of their shell and support tired, borderline racist policies that they used to scream and shout about in the 60's, 70's, and 80's.

Honestly, what we need is a true moderate. Doesn't matter what side of the aisle they're on, provided that they are able to span both sides. A great negotiator who understands the arguments from both parties and gets them compromise on the more outlandish ideas to come up with something that works for the whole country. I don't want a candidate who's first course of action is to attack negative criticism. I want one who looks at it from their side, begins a dialogue, and creates a situation where the outcome is ultimately as positive as it can be for both sides. Unfortunately, I see no one like that in the political realm right now.

I think a lot of people fail to realize that the President is really just an administrator. They aren't supposed to be some popular media figure. They aren't supposed to be the end all be all of their administration. The idea is to hire the right people for the job, and the administration should basically run itself. They aren't the law maker, they are the law enforcer. Should they be able to get the law makers to understand what laws are necessary? Absolutely. Should they bully people and ignore what the law makers do because they disagree? Absolutely not.
 

Gedunker

Moderating
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Moderator
Messages
11,438
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39
I agree generally. We don't have someone who could bridge the gap that is within either party right now. What about Mark Cuban? Someone outside the game?

I think the D's have AOC and Bernie and Warren and the progressive push that is "leading" a lot of their ideas, and the R's have Trump and Cruz maybe? I am not certain other than Trump who is pushing any new ideas within the Republican party. Rand Paul on the libertarian side?

The D's may have some, what some would consider crazy ideas (Green New Deal, Medicare for All, etc.), but they are putting ideas out there. I cannot think of a unique R idea that is pushing forward our country? I don't know that I can put my finger on an R policy that is keeping us even? Border protection maybe? What policy position is being pushed by an R right now that is outside of what we are already doing? Drilling maybe?
I'm thinking Mayor Pete might be that guy for the Dems. He needs a cabinet position (hopefully not HUD) to add some gravitas to his resume. But, I think he has as good a chance as anyone to be the face of the D's for a long while.
 

terraplnr

Cyburbian
Messages
2,355
Points
27
I attended a junior high named after a Confederate General (Stonewall Jackson). It was apparently named after him when the school was built back in the 1940's, when it was constructed on a former plantation and only allowed white students. I thought it was weird back in the 90's to be going to a school named after a Confederate General. The local school board decided yesterday to rename the school, by a unanimous vote. :up:
 

michaelskis

Cyburbian
Messages
20,055
Points
50
When is it enough? At first the conservatives were angry because of how the production of Hamilton was created and how non-white actors were playing white historic figures. Now liberals are saying that the celebration of any of the founding fathers is recast. Where does this end?


 

Suburb Repairman

moderator in moderation
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Moderator
Messages
7,402
Points
33
I'm thinking Mayor Pete might be that guy for the Dems. He needs a cabinet position (hopefully not HUD) to add some gravitas to his resume. But, I think he has as good a chance as anyone to be the face of the D's for a long while.
Democrats:
There's a lot of new energy & ideas out there. Whether they all fit is TBD, but they've got vocal people with records & respect. Dems have always struggled to coalesce around leaders, and have a bad tendency to eat their own.
  • Mayor Pete would be a good fit with Commerce or Treasury.
  • Julian Castro squandered his potential. He's done.
  • AOC is interesting. I expect her to slowly moderate as she gets more skilled in sausage-making in order to advance her causes.
  • A number of interesting governors out there.
  • Kamala Harris is showing potential, especially in recent months
  • Tammy Duckworth is someone I pay a lot of attention to.
Republicans:
Their cupboards are bare. See my comment above. Their platform has been "OMG Dems is scary fear Fear FEAR" for so long that they don't have a real platform. They don't propose anything. If anything, their platform is stripping away rights and appointing "conservative" judges (in quotes because these conservative judges have typically been the most activist, and they are conservative exclusively from Christian perspectives).
  • Ted Cruz damn near lost to Beto O'Rourke, which seems to have almost politically neutered him for any further advancement. I don't think he'll win his next election. John Cornyn actually looks like he might be in trouble as well. Texans get pretty pissy when they think you've forgotten where you came from.
  • Paul Ryan really missed his opportunity. He really surprised me.
  • Marco Rubio has an incredible amount of baggage
  • John Kasich missed his opportunity
  • Jon Huntsman has almost completely self-destructed in a bit of a shock
  • Nikki Haley feels like she is playing the game too much, and missed opportunities to separate herself
  • Tim Scott... look at his record. He is impressively out of touch, and has been nowhere near vocal enough.
  • Josh Hawley is similarly out of touch. Youth =/= with it. Both he and Scott are holding tightly to beliefs that are no longer held by the majority of self-identifying conservatives anymore
 

JNA

Cyburbian Plus
Messages
25,656
Points
60
Mary L. Trumps's book about her uncle donald -

"Too Much and Never Enough: How My Family Created the World's Most Dangerous Man,"
The news articles with select quotes - just WOW.
 

gtpeach

Cyburbian
Messages
2,082
Points
21
When is it enough? At first the conservatives were angry because of how the production of Hamilton was created and how non-white actors were playing white historic figures. Now liberals are saying that the celebration of any of the founding fathers is recast. Where does this end?


I don't think it SHOULD end. I'm not saying that Hamilton is terrible and the running of the show should be stopped, but it also doesn't mean it's without it's flaws. And regardless of what ultimately happens, I think the conversations and discussions are important.
 

michaelskis

Cyburbian
Messages
20,055
Points
50
I don't think it SHOULD end. I'm not saying that Hamilton is terrible and the running of the show should be stopped, but it also doesn't mean it's without it's flaws. And regardless of what ultimately happens, I think the conversations and discussions are important.
When you say 'it' has its flaws, are you referring to the musical or the reality aspects of the story? I am sure that Hamilton and Jefferson never had a rap battle, so that is a given... but with the exception of 1 person about 2000 years ago, EVERYONE has flaws... some more apparent than others. Do we fore sake everyone because of their errors in life, or do we celibate the good that they have done while acknowledging the bad?

Overall, I loved the production. I thought it was extremely well done, I felt that it held true to the foundational elements of the time and situation, and I appreciated the creativity taken to give it a modern feel. I think it painted a much more accurate picture of the life and times of these historical figures, and showed both the good and the bad.

The only thing that I did not understand is why Ben Franklin wasn't even mentioned.
 

gtpeach

Cyburbian
Messages
2,082
Points
21
When you say 'it' has its flaws, are you referring to the musical or the reality aspects of the story? I am sure that Hamilton and Jefferson never had a rap battle, so that is a given... but with the exception of 1 person about 2000 years ago, EVERYONE has flaws... some more apparent than others. Do we fore sake everyone because of their errors in life, or do we celibate the good that they have done while acknowledging the bad?
I was referring to Hamilton the musical as still being problematic. But again, I just don't think we stop having these conversations. When is enough enough? I don't know that we ever get to that point. It doesn't mean that people ever stop being problematic or that we can never honor people who do great things despite their flaws. But it does mean that honoring them is also done in context.
 

DVD

Cyburbian
Messages
14,808
Points
51
So my local congressman is running around telling everyone covid is no big deal, you don't need a mask, etc. So of course people are taking medical advice from their congressman instead of a doctor. Isn't there a law about practicing medicine without a license? Can I sue the guy for malpractice if I get sick?
 

JNA

Cyburbian Plus
Messages
25,656
Points
60
Hamilton -

Musical is entertainment. to make history "relatable"
Better yet read the book that inspired Lin-Manuel Miranda - Ron Chernow's Alexander Hamilton biography

How Lin-Manuel Miranda Shapes History
 

Doohickie

Cyburbian
Messages
2,804
Points
38
Clearly, it’s also important for those of y’all who oppose Trump and Kanye to also examine your fragility. Actually read what I wrote. This isn’t for you to defend yourself, because this post literally is not about you. But you made it about you and that is something that whiteness does.
I read this as, "Only talk about what I want to talk about and if you talk about something else I'm per-emptively calling you fragile."
 

Doohickie

Cyburbian
Messages
2,804
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38
Mark Cuban isn't bad, but I just don't know enough about him personally to say he'd be good as a politician.
I get the sense that he won't be able to handle the stuff in LP's post well enough to govern. He'd be better than the current occupant, but I don't think he'd be that much better. I think he also knows that and wouldn't run. He likes being on the outside and lobbing grenades.
 
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Super Amputee Cat

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Messages
2,225
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30
Everyone knows that Trump is a lying sack of $hit, but here's a reminder that Pence is an even bigger piece of human excrement.

This is from the Wall Street Journal, April 23, 2020

Pence 2020-04-23.jpg

No Mr. Pence, the Pandemic did not end in June. Exact opposite in fact. Nor will it be over by January. But hopefully Pence's Vice-Presidency will.
 

Doohickie

Cyburbian
Messages
2,804
Points
38
So my local congressman is running around telling everyone covid is no big deal, you don't need a mask, etc. So of course people are taking medical advice from their congressman instead of a doctor. Isn't there a law about practicing medicine without a license? Can I sue the guy for malpractice if I get sick?
Interesting. My congressman just posted on Facebook that we should defund the police (by way of voting no for a proposition that would continue a half cent sales tax to fund the Crime Control and Prevention District which funds a lot of the toys we've given the police for the last 25 years).

Well, not exactly my congressman... this guy:
I just had a nice conversation on Facebook with my* congressman about R&B music.

*I'm not actually in his district by just a few blocks, but I've met him several times and I feel he represents me in Washington better than my actual congresswoman.
 

gtpeach

Cyburbian
Messages
2,082
Points
21
I read this as, "Only talk about what I want to talk about and if you talk about something else I'm per-emptively calling you fragile."
That probably makes more sense based on the comments she was receiving on her post. But she has a right to say what she wants to say. And she is unapologetic about not letting the feelings of white people dominate conversations about how to appropriately respond to racism, and I think that’s fair.
 

Doohickie

Cyburbian
Messages
2,804
Points
38
Yes, it sounds like it was a response to comments in response. But.... okay, so I can't think about a but that doesn't make me sound fragile...
 

Maister

Chairman of the bored
Staff member
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28,414
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71
Everyone knows that Trump is a lying sack of $hit, but here's a reminder that Pence is an even bigger piece of human excrement.

This is from the Wall Street Journal, April 23, 2020

View attachment 48565

No Mr. Pence, the Pandemic did not end in June. Exact opposite in fact. Nor will it be over by January. But hopefully Pence's Vice-Presidency will.
I don't always agree with everything you say, but clearly Trump and to a lesser extent Pence, have focused their public messaging energy into peddling a 'magical thinking' narrative ever since Corona reared its head....this is nothing....it's going away....I predict this will just disappear when spring comes...things are getting much better...it's completely under control...all the while numbers of cases continues to climb and this country now has the highest unemployment rate seen since the Great Depression. Suggesting all the while this novel virus, which is crippling the global economy and causing ripples that will undoubtedly be felt for years to come, is somehow a hoax or at the very least a hugely overblown threat that for some mysterious reason has caused every country on earth to shut down. This isn't happening. Ignore the mainstream media. This isn't happening. This isn't happening....
Why would they do this as opposed to the leadership tack taken by someone like Governor Coumo, where leadership honestly acknowledges the threats we're facing, openly admits the numbers and shortcomings to the public, places trust and confidence in the experts to deal with it and devise policies in accordance with their recommendations? Why not take the virus head on as a united people instead of trying to sow division - particularly when the consequences of those divisions result directly and negatively on the public (republicans don't wear masks or social distance, lift state restrictions when cases are still on the rise, suggest ingesting bleach and/or sunlight, etc)?
 

AG74683

Cyburbian
Messages
7,094
Points
39
I get the sense that he won't be able to handle the stuff in LP's post well enough to govern. He'd be better that the current occupant, but I don't think he'd be that much better. I think he also knows that and wouldn't run. He likes being on the outside and lobbing grenades.
I agree, and that's why I'm hesitant about Cuban. That said, his more inflammatory comments are generally on the right side of things, he just tells it like it is with no sugar coating.
 

Veloise

Cyburbian
Messages
5,787
Points
32
I feel like a lot people play this game, what if. Unfortunately there are been a lot of situations that weren't great, but wondering what would you have done really is a pointless effort. What does it matter?
...
It can be helpful to role-play what you would do in different situations. Like rehearsing for any performance, council meeting, live hit for a TV camera.
 

arcplans

As Featured in "High Times"
Messages
6,641
Points
32
Everyone knows that Trump is a lying sack of $hit, but here's a reminder that Pence is an even bigger piece of human excrement.

This is from the Wall Street Journal, April 23, 2020

View attachment 48565

No Mr. Pence, the Pandemic did not end in June. Exact opposite in fact. Nor will it be over by January. But hopefully Pence's Vice-Presidency will.
TBH Pence is just a good lap dog. Wags his tail when he is told to, put on the ticket for his "faith" and clealy follows the Hulk Hogan1 way of life:
  • Train
  • Say your prayers
  • Eat your vitamins
  • Be true to yourself
  • Be a real american
1: Hulk Hogan circa 1983-1996 where hogan turned heel and formed the NwO, thereby spawning "hollywood hulk hogan" and the moniker "cheat to win"
 
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