The NEVERENDING Political Discussion Thread

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FWIW, while I don't agree with all of her policy positions, I have no problem with AOC or her "behavior" or "composure". She's under 30. She's of a different generation than 95% of the rest of the folks in the House and Senate and I don't expect her to behave the same as them. I also don't have much sympathy for the, "She needs to sit down and learn her role and earn some respect" argument that you hear from so many on the left and the right. She was elected by her constituents and is beholden to them. She's earned her position just as much as any of the other 434 members of the House.

Let her get in there and shake things up a bit. I fully expect that her positions will change as she's been in office longer and she gains more experience but I haven't seen anything that she's done that has been offensive or that I would view as trying too hard - she definitely hasn't done anything as cringeworthy as Elizabeth Warren's Instagram video with the beer. In fact, I'd say that thanks to her age, nearly every social media post or video I've seen with AOC comes off as far more natural and relatable than just about anything any of the other high-profile members put out which always seem so contrived and focus-grouped.
 

Hink

OH....IO
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I disagree. If they really were, Pelosi wouldn't be the Speaker. I think most of the long term democrats see people like AOC, Harris, Gabbard, and Sanders as outliers who threaten to disrupt the establishment. There are policies and protocols even for democrats and these folks push the envelope. From what I've read, there is a significant number of House democrats that dislike AOC. I'd say I'm relatively centrist, but if I were to classify myself in one of the two parties, I'd be a conservative democrat. I cannot stand AOC to be honest. She is trying way too hard without any real experience and needs to chill out. She is wearing out her welcome fast.

Dem's need a great uniter. Someone who can bring in the center of both parties. Those new progressives are just too progressive for those in the middle or even slightly right. None of those folks above will get any respect from the right, save for Sanders, simply because he's got experience. If they want to establish a long term base of power, they need someone who can work with both sides and get conservatives to forget that they are a Democrat.
Pelosi was chosen so she could burn bridges and then retire without blood on the newbies hands. The Democrats are really good at screwing up easy wins. I completely agree with you about uniting our country, but the Democrats should just want to win. They need to pick someone who doesn't alienate half the electorate with their views. They need someone who can stay on message and focus on bringing middle America up. A message of inclusivity and open government would work. They also need to figure out how to rebrand the Green New Deal into something more digestable. People want efficiency, and better infrastructure, and smarter cities, etc., but they are selling it too hard with the old style. They cannot say they will tax anyone more. It won't sell to middle America. Villianizing / punishing successful people has never worked for the D's. They should stay clear of those arguments.
 

AG74683

Cyburbian
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FWIW, while I don't agree with all of her policy positions, I have no problem with AOC or her "behavior" or "composure". She's under 30. She's of a different generation than 95% of the rest of the folks in the House and Senate and I don't expect her to behave the same as them.
That's all well and good, and I'm inclined to agree, but our positions are irrelevant, it's the party that matters. If she wants to do good for her constituents, she's going to need party support, and she's off to a bad start. It's frustrating because you absolutely want her to be herself, but that just won't work. She's doing more harm than good right now. It's a game, and right now she's in last place.

Pelosi was chosen so she could burn bridges and then retire without blood on the newbies hands. The Democrats are really good at screwing up easy wins. I completely agree with you about uniting our country, but the Democrats should just want to win. They need to pick someone who doesn't alienate half the electorate with their views. They need someone who can stay on message and focus on bringing middle America up.
I think "just win" isn't the best position, because then you end up with candidates like Clinton or Obama. I didn't dislike Obama, and I think he did a good job, but clearly there was significant animosity, otherwise Trump/Clinton wouldn't have the same result. To be fair, Clinton was an atrocious candidate.

They need a long term plan, someone who can stick through two terms and not have to worry about the next candidate taking the election. They use the wrong arguments for every single social or environmental thing they try to push. It's all about the "people" or "saving the planet" which is all well and good, but those aren't things Republicans generally think about, nor really care. Bottom line is that they want fiscal responsibility (which is hilarious but it's still an important party position), and those programs cost money. The argument should be based on return on investment. YES these programs will cost money, but here are the potential savings. Every argument should be based on how these programs can directly benefit the economy.
 

DVD

Cyburbian
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I think my problem with the parties is the same old tired people the keep trotting out for potential candidates. When it comes to house or senate I take that as a more local issue. The state and the state parties should get the right people out there. If NY want AOC then that's fine with me. She represents NY and not me (good or bad). My problem is the next or last presidential race. Both parties keep throwing their used junk at us to vote on. So a good centrist like me has no one I can get behind to vote for. I get the choice of extremes or candidates that have so much baggage that I'm ready for a change. There must be some benign and effective Senator, Governor or someone that can actually do a good job and not just ham it up for the cameras or make radical statements just to get coverage. You know, someone who will actually govern.
 

arcplans

As Featured in "High Times"
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While its early I honestly think Shultz would take away votes from any democratic nominee, thus giving trump 4 more years, assuming he survives nomination. I honestly wouldn't mind Bloomberg. I think he would be good for the nation. The dems will figure out a way to put the least electable person on the ballot.
 

Hink

OH....IO
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See I can like AOC. She at least speaks to a lot of points that the R's seem to forget...

Bloomberg Article said:
Soon, though, Meadows and other Republicans were telling Chairman Elijah Cummings of Maryland that members should get more than three days’ notice to attend questioning of witnesses by Democratic staff lawyers. Meadows said five days was better, particularly for lawmakers who live far from Washington.
Ocasio-Cortez wasted no time in offering her first remarks on the committee. “I don’t believe we need five days” if lawmakers are doing their jobs, she responded.
Meadows wasn’t going to let that go. Formally directing his remarks to Cummings, he responded: “Mr. Chairman, I can tell you on all of this at this particular point, we’re all wanting to cooperate.” But he said, “Sometimes our schedules, you know, we’re not just sitting around eating bonbons, waiting for the call of anybody.”
Ocasio-Cortez then asked Cummings whether Republicans gave members ample notice for such matters during the last congressional session, when they ran the committee.
“No,” said Cummings, of Maryland.
“OK, thank you,” said Ocasio-Cortez.
Do you remember a month ago when the rules were different? The smell of hypocrisy is ripe.
 

gtpeach

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Our governor (Virginia) is making a big mess of this recent scandal. If you haven't heard, someone found a photo in his med school yearbook that is allegedly of him that shows him posing in black face with someone else dressed as a klans man. He's a democratic governor. Initially he apologized for it, then later said that he is not the person in the photo. Everyone is calling for him to resign.

I'm torn on the whole thing. It's a crappy thing to do, and if he took responsibility and owned it, I feel like maybe people wouldn't be so hard-core over calling for his resignation. But at the same time, he was still the best option to promote the welfare of minorities when he was elected. Our Lieutenant Governor is African American, so I'm also wondering if maybe that contributes to the calls for his resignation at this point. If he would be replaced by another white man, would people be pushing so hard?

I did vote for our Lieutenant Governor, and I liked him, but he's also REALLY young and inexperienced. So this could be interesting.
 
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Watched about 5 minutes of the SOTU and it was all I needed to understand the following:

Trump wants a wall
Trump supports our police and border patrol
Republicans will stand and clap for everything he says
Democrats refuse to applaud even if it is justified only because Trump said it.


Once again, this is a symbol of a significant problem. Politics over common sense for both parties.
 

DVD

Cyburbian
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I was playing video games with the oldest. Much better use of my time than hearing Blah blah unity blah blah wall blah blah I'm great and you're not.
 

Big Owl

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I watched none of it. First time in years. I saw no reason to. Watched the Hurricanes game instead.
The bar that I play rock & roll bingo had the NC State vs Carolina game, Hurricanes, and 30 other sporting events but no SOTU address. I did see a old guy at the bar watching it on his phone though.
 

Suburb Repairman

moderator in moderation
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I got about four minutes into it, started mumbling curse words under my breath, and then switched to streaming Marvelous Mrs. Maisel with my wife.

I don't think I missed anything.

And honestly, I was a bit hopeful about the SOTU being cancelled altogether. I think it is an obsolete and useless practice that doesn't do anything to further the conversation or negotiations.
 

Bubba

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And honestly, I was a bit hopeful about the SOTU being cancelled altogether. I think it is an obsolete and useless practice that doesn't do anything to further the conversation or negotiations.
As a general observation, I'm good with this - go back to handling the obligation for it in written form.
 
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I watched exactly as much of this SOTY address as I had from any by Obama or Bush or Clinton - 0 minutes.

I do generally read the transcript the next day (and plan to do that later today). That way I get the gist of the address without all the self-important pomp.
 
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