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Tuscan Invasion

Messages
5,352
Points
31
How about a little more information? Where is this located? Is it out in the boonies? I doubt if it's infill because I don't really see any mature trees.
 

PlannerByDay

Cyburbian
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1,827
Points
24
While I don't have a clue where this is, I'm guessin it is in the southwest US somewhere.

Which makes me wonder why they have "lawns" or grass (while it is brown) in the first picture. Neighborhoods with "lawns" in the southwest US (assuming that is where it is) are a tremendous waste of water and IMO, anyone with lawn which requires watering is flatout dumb (sorry SW US lawn people, your not really dumb only your desire to have a green lawn is)
 

Tranplanner

maudit anglais
Messages
7,909
Points
36
PlannerByDay said:
While I don't have a clue where this is, I'm guessin it is in the southwest US somewhere.
I think it's in Australia actually. Though the SF homes look awful, the apartments don't look too bad (on their own).
 

PlannerByDay

Cyburbian
Messages
1,827
Points
24
Tranplanner said:
I think it's in Australia actually. Though the SF homes look awful, the apartments don't look too bad (on their own).
OH YEAH, I guess DA Monkey is from Redcliffe, Queensland.

Regradless, I feel the same way. I too think the Apts. look alright.
 

BKM

Cyburbian
Messages
6,463
Points
29
I posted this comment before, but when I was watching one of those nature shows on PBS, and they were showing koala bears in local neighborhood parks in Queensland. The neighborhood looked just like Southern California!
 

The Irish One

Member
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2,267
Points
25
The houses look like SoCal and the apartments look like San Diego's little Italy. I'll take pics to show all the cool apartment buildings in down town that look like their out of a seventies Italian art film. I really like them :)
Time to plant some native Australian plants in those yards!
 

BKM

Cyburbian
Messages
6,463
Points
29
I read on an Australian Board one night an interesting debate about this issue (native versus non-native trees) Several posters were complaining that the use of native trees (eucalyptus in Australia) was somehow "suburban" in character, and that City of Melbourne needed to continue planting the English/European varieties "characteristic" of the older civic parks and streets.

As the proud owner of Eucalyptus, they are pretty messy :)
 

The Irish One

Member
Messages
2,267
Points
25
moderation

Destroy all non natives ;-)

I think there are plenty of legitimate reasons for nonnatives such as scottish grass for the kids in parks, ornamentals, etc... In suburban rural interface eucalyptus is a threat to your house in the event of a wild fire or any fire for that matter.
 

BKM

Cyburbian
Messages
6,463
Points
29
The Irish One said:
Destroy all non natives ;-)

I think there are plenty of legitimate reasons for nonnatives such as scottish grass for the kids in parks, ornamentals, etc... In suburban rural interface eucalyptus is a threat to your house in the event of a wild fire or any fire for that matter.
True...I don't live in such an interface. My sister certainly does.

Nor do I agree with that sentiment if it means purging a huge city park of all of its trees so that a gray green weed can grow back (San Francisco proposal)

An interesting argument I read recently was that removing vegetation actually works better in higher elevation pine forests. Removing vegetation in coastal scrub/oak areas dries the soils out and makes fires more likely and intense. Interesting
 

DA Monkey

Cyburbian
Messages
84
Points
4
Sorry for the lack of detailed information, I was in a hurry and got interrupted.

The site is in a new estate that has opened on our city border- its not actually in Redcliffe, however, it is in a suburban area that has been established for some time.

My gripe was in relation to the ubiquitous nature of the tuscan style of home that has been the darling of the estate developers over the last few years.

The picture of the housing is terrible, I dont know how people could buy them.

I actually like the units although they are in an older suburb and dont fit in with the neighborhood too well. They tend to dominate the local area and reflect a trend towards more similar style of units being built in the area.

The lawn and tree planting comments are interesting. Redcliffe is an older suburb and fairly typical of development styles from around the forties and fifties. Over the years there has been a mix of more modern buildings being developed which reflect the changing nature of the suburb from a retirement/dormitory suburb to more of a bayside urban village.

Lawns are very much the norm and many houses go to great lengths in lawn care, often achieving a golfing green look (my property has just graduated from being a paddock to a yard -eventually it may be a lawn, who knows :-} ). No great issues with natives trees etc, although I have just finished removing all the palms, pines and other crappy trees from my yard (19 trees and 7 palms). I left some great firs, a huge ghost gum, and a moreton bay fig (a real monster) as well as a smattering of leopard trees etc.

Redcliffe itself has extensive native wetlands and bush adjoining the urban area. I still get an assortment of wildlife (wallabies, the odd koala, marsupial mice snakes lizards etc) from the bushland behind my house. All of the remaining bushland and wetlands are now protected from development, so I will get to enjoy my own private fire hazard for a bit longer. :-D
 

JNL

Cyburbian
Messages
2,449
Points
25
I stayed with friends in Parkinson, Queensland, in November in a subdivision that looked just like the first picture. The circuitous residential roads with lots of baby roundabouts would quickly drive me nuts, but they seemed to like it. They were on the edge of the subdivision, bordering an access road but with high fences and their back turned to this road (and they wonder why the fence gets graffiti?!?!) so they had to drive in the opposite direction through a maze-like series of turns before they could get out!

Your third photo makes me miss the Gold Coast climate. It is raining and an unseasonable 10C here today :(
 

DA Monkey

Cyburbian
Messages
84
Points
4
JNL said:
I stayed with friends in Parkinson, (
I like Parkinson, although it is a long way from here. I remember it as natural bushland setting with large rural residential lots.

But that south corridor (Albert Shire, Ormeau, Nerang etc) has seen a lot of growth and will see heaps more yet.

I know what you mean by circuitous roads and baby roundabouts - its like developers think its the only way to build estates these days. I wonder what they will be like in 30 or so years?
 

BKM

Cyburbian
Messages
6,463
Points
29
Architectural styles go through phases, of course. We are moving from similar "Tuscan" (they call it "Mediterranean" here) back to more arts and crafts style housing.

The one thing I liked, at least from the photographs, is that your street widths appear much narrower than the typical California design, which assumes three fire trucks driving down the road simultaneously with cars parked along both sides of the road (Just kidding).
 

Dan

Dear Leader
Staff member
Moderator
Messages
18,601
Points
69
The houses you've posted look like they could be in suburban Los Angeles, San Diego or Las Vegas; not surprising, given the similar climate and proximity to Australia. It's fascinating seeing typical new-build residential architecture from outside North America.

The Tuscan/Northern Italian influence is gaining a stronghold in the Cleveland area, especially in new, upscale residential and commercial development, but the frame Great Lakes colonial/contemporary and the multi-gabled American McMansion look still reigns supreme.

It's interesting looking at the houses on the Web site of a national homebuilder, like Pulte Homes. You can get the same floorplan anywhere in they build, but the facade wil be completely different; colonial in Ohio, very colonial in Massachusetts, mountain lodgeish in Colorado, Tuscan/Mediterranean in Florida, brick in Texas.
 

Howard Roark

Cyburbian
Messages
276
Points
10
Romanticized imports of foreign vernacular have been going on for some time. Wren was influenced (and copied) the Greeks and Romans (who had copied the Greeks) The Victorians were obsessed w/ Italian ruins and every garden became an Anglicized version of Tuscany. Country Club Plaza in KC was styled after Andalucian theme.

The difference now is that these are essentially modern housing dressed up with a few bad trappings of old classic cannons of the design order. Kind of dumbing it down for today’s taste. But then again these are not actually “architect designed” as much as they are builder designed architect inspired.

If you want a good lecture on; the nature of capitalism, personal property rights, the ethos of market dynamics, and uh… do you know where your next check is coming from, try suggesting as alternate to the developers vision that might be a more suitable product for the effect that they are trying to produce.
 

BKM

Cyburbian
Messages
6,463
Points
29
Howard Roark said:
Romanticized imports of foreign vernacular have been going on for some time. Wren was influenced (and copied) the Greeks and Romans (who had copied the Greeks) The Victorians were obsessed w/ Italian ruins and every garden became an Anglicized version of Tuscany. Country Club Plaza in KC was styled after Andalucian theme..
Which is why I am always skeptical of the Neo-Classical Architectural Cult when they claim that traditional architecture needs to reconquer America. A very watered down version of traditionalism already does rule the world, outside a few showpiece projects. And, even the examples they give of "New Classical" buildings are often, somehow, just not very convincing (or appealing). Still, since modernism has pretty much utterly failed (outside of a few enclaves like Art Deco Miami Beach) to create an attractive, humane vernacular, I guess we'll have to live with "Developer Colonial" and the regional versions therof. Heck, I would probably prefer a nice beaux-arts 1900 temple to the Koolhaas thing in Seattle (opinion from drawings and photos only :))
 

Cardinal

Cyburbian
Messages
10,080
Points
34
The city I live in is known in part for its collection of Italianate homes (and some commercial buildings) built from the 1850's through 1880's. This style would not be entirely out of place here, despite the fact that we are a long way from Italy. Personally, I like to see new styles of architecture evolve every few years. It is good to get away from the American Bland style that has dominated the last half-century.
 

ABS

Messages
103
Points
6
I like Parkinson too, pretty nice suburb. Although 730M2 homesites are a bit too inefficient.
 
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