War Against Iraq?

[SouthSideSlayer]

What do you think about it?

(I'm not talking about the comic..)

 

[PlannerGirl]

I think Bush is out of his mind

i do NOT support this push to invade.

D

 

[Repo Man]

The notion that Iraq would attack the US interests is ridiculous. Saddam may be a bastard and evil, but he is not stupid. He knows that if he does anything, within 24 hours the US will begin bombing Iraq and within 30 days he will either be dead, captured, or on the run and there will be a "regime change" in Iraq. I don't support the Bush argument that we have to remove him because he "might" be developing waepons of mass destruction that he "might" use against the US.

 

[Planderella]

I think Bush is underestimating Saddam Hussein.

 

[Tranplanner]

I definitely think Saddam Hussein should be removed from power - the long list of transgressions and atrocities he has instigated transcend mere "internal" matters. The outstanding UN resolutions, the use of chemical weapons against his own people, the initiation of aggressive war against Kuwait and Iran, etc. all tell me he is somebody that the international community should take action against.

What pisses me off is the politics involved - we didn't do anything against him when he was a "friend" of the west, and then we didn't punish him enough during/after Desert Storm. So now, the optics of removing him look bad - it's George Jr. trying to complete the job his dad couldn't. I think that's what it looks like to a lot of other countries.

I agree with jtfortin - the mere fact that he may be developing weapons of mass destruction isn't enough to act now. Not seeing as we haven't done anything for the past 10 years when he was dicking the UN around.

Unfortunately, that means we may have to wait for another terrorist attack or worse before acting.

 

[Mastiff]

Send El Guapo with a rifle and a scope.

 

[Glomer]

Oh.....you blame america first liberals give me a headache.

The notion that Iraq would attack the US interests is ridiculous. Saddam may be a bastard and evil, but he is not stupid. He knows that if he does anything, within 24 hours the US will begin bombing Iraq and within 30 days he will either be dead, captured, or on the run and there will be a "regime change" in Iraq.

how does Saddam know that????? if we don't fight back? Saddam was given a set of rules to follow by the UN. He broke all of them.

President Bush and the United States, although many of the democrats don't seem to want to believe, are still at war!!!! We will destroy anyone who is any threat to our country. You liberals forget too quickly after sept. 11th. It was OK for us to retaliate, but not finish the job. (i.e. Clinton launching a couple missles between his romps with Monica)

What is the Democrats stand, I ask you. They keep making up excuses on why we should delay, but they won't make a stand on what we should do. Typical liberal leadership! They told bush he must go to the UN. He went.......and told them to either do something, make him follow the rules they laid out for him a long time ago, or the STEP ASIDE and I'll do it for you.

You say Bush doesn't have the support of the American people. Have you checked his approval rating lately?

Let me ask you, what do we push for as planners???? To be proactive, rather than reactive... It is about time that we do just that, and it is about time that we have a leader that will do just that. When we take out Saddam......The streets of Iraq will be rejoicing. The world will be a better place with him out of power, just as it was with Hitler out of power. (although there were liberal blame america first people back then that didn't want us to fight Germany)

There are some leaders who rise to the occasion. Leaders that are ment to lead at certain a certain time. Clinton was ment to lead at the time he did......Thanks to Reagan (I know people won't like that) the economy was on the up and up. There wasn't anything Clinton could do to screw things up......the only thing he could do is ruin the character and morality of the presidential office (HE ACCOMPLISHED THAT)

Bush was ment to lead at this time. When you go to bed at night and know that you can sleep safe.....be glad that he is running the show and not Gore......You want Bush on that line, you need bush on that line.

 

[Repo Man]

Oh.....you blame america first liberals give me a headache.

President Bush and the United States, although many of the democrats don't seem to want to believe, are still at war!!!! We will destroy anyone who is any threat to our country. You liberals forget too quickly after sept. 11th. It was OK for us to retaliate, but not finish the job. (i.e. Clinton launching a couple missles between his romps with Monica)

I am so sick and tired of conservatives playing the "blame america first" or the "anti-patriotic" card. Just because someone thinks that the US should not remove Saddam, doesn't mean that they hate america or want to blame America. My point is that in the sanctions against Iraq are from the UN and if the UN decides to remove him that is fine. If the UN wants to explore other options, the US should also explore these options before beating the war drum.

You comment about not finishing the job can be traced right back to President George Bush and current members of this administration that didn't finish the job in 1991 when they could have removed Saddam.

 

[poncho]

We are at war? I will give you that, but tell me what war are we at, terrorism, weapons of mass destruction, regime change, or oil. Since Reagan was so brilliant , why cant we use the cold war tactics and wait it out.
Where is the evidence, aluminum tubes, I guess that is part of the great secret presidency, we don't really need to know.

And if we will destroy anyone who is a threat to our country why is Ashcroft still the AG. (that was a joke, please don't report me for being unpatriotic)

I do think there is a time and place for war, Afganastan might have been one but I do believe war should be the last resort. It seems like a Greek Tragedy more than anything else.

 

[Wannaplan?]

This whole business about a war with Iraq is getting tiresome. Either our country should do something or just shut-up about it. I can't even watch the news anymore because it's always about the "debate" surrounding the "Showdown with Saddam." **yawn** There is no new news anymore about Iraq - it's just a war with words among America's Greatest Figureheads: Daschle, Bush, Powell, and Rice, and other talking heads. This whole business of politics in this country is a sham - the more I think about it, the more apolitical I want to become. I think it all began during the broadcast of the Clinton testimony in 1999 - "That depends on what is is." When I saw that, a lightbulb went on over my head - elected officials talk sh** for a reason. Ever since then, I have paid more close attention to what's said, how it's said, and why it's said. Basically, I don't trust politicians at face value anymore - they're always up to something. With that in mind, and knowing that Iraq has some of the largest oil reserves in the world, and knowing that Bush & Cheney are oil businessmen themselves, I am skeptical that the whole "War with Iraq" is just about getting an "evil" man out of power. Bush & Cheney have strong interests in oil - if Saddam was a lobsterman, I'm sure we wouldn't hear a peep about him. If Bush were truly concerned about weapons of mass destruction, then he'd head on over to India and work to find a peaceful solution to resolving the Kashmir conflict between India and Pakistan. Those countries were so close to nuclear war in May!! Talk about weapons of mass destruction!

 

[prudence]

Bomb early, bomb often...kind of like Chicago democratic politics. Closure is necessary. It's funny how only a few short years ago that Daschle expressed that there was great need to attack Iraq, because his boss Slick Willie was trying to deflect from his transgressions (think Wag The Dog) and today Daschle sings a different tune.

I agree with Glomer...and EG with a scope and rifle is a winning idea regardless of the situation.

 

[Chet]

Closure, my dear Prudence, is only necessary because George Sr. didnt finish what he started 12 years ago! Now the son has to clean up the mess left by his father, and his father's lying cheating S.O.S. successor. BTW - wasn't it George H.W. Bush. that funded Osama and the Taliban in Afghanistan when they were fighting off the Soviets? HMMMMMM. The circle is complete.

It really pissed me off when Dubya told the UN to join the US against Iraq or we'd do it outrselves anyway.

 

[Glomer]

Bturk: It really pissed me off when Dubya told the UN to join the US against Iraq or we'd do it outrselves anyway.

why did that piss you off? It pisses me off that we think we have to ask the UN who doesn't follow through with its own sanctions.

Analogy....I'll admit it is dumb......but the best I can think of off hand.

Lets say your child is getting beat up at school. The school board (UN) says we will take care of it. Your child continues to get threats and you just know something could happen. You want to do something before it is too late........... If it were me, I would say screw the school board (UN) and take matters into my own hands to protect my child.


Dumb analogy, but get my point??????

 

[Repo Man]

This is not meant to be an Anti-American statement, but I am sick and tired of the US refusing to sign environmental and other treaties, agreements, goals etc. endorsed by the majority of the world's develped countries, then having a fit when other countries don't go along with our plans. I know war against Iraq and some environmental treaty are two entirely different things, but I can't help but think that the US's refusal to cooperate on other global issues has played a big part in other countries denouncing our plans to remove Saddam.

 

[Wannaplan?]

This is not meant to be an Anti-American statement...

Why the paranoia? I think we need more critical statements about this country. We have the right to do that. You guys don't have to apologize - just say them.

 

[Runner]

Unfortunately, that means we may have to wait for another terrorist attack or worse before acting.

I pray and hope that this is not the case. If we think Sept 11 was bad the next attack, with the corresponding sick need in the terrorist mind to top the last attack, is not going to be pleasant... Maybe closer to Dan's pictures only of a U.S. city.

That said I don't think that Saddam would ever attack the U.S., directly. He would also be adept at covering his tracks. I fear his method would be letting some of his "technology" "accidentally" fall into the hands of the super terrorists.

Bottom line: I don't think we can afford to wait. But if we do, I guess the anti war crowd will be singing a different tune as they watch CCN's coverage of the ashtray that used to me an American city.

On a side note I read an interesting editorial the other day on our current war. Its point was that claiming to fight a "war on terrorism" is a failed concept. Terrorism is a tactic just as a flanking maneuver is a tactic. We need to acknowledge that this is a war against radical fundamental Islam and get on with it.

 

[Jeff]

Kill em all I say!! All the liberals too!!

It just pisses me off that we waited until I was out of the USMC to go back and finish the job.

No seriously, I blame alot of this on us. We never finished the job during Desert Storm because the American public 99.9% of whom have never served a day in their life in military say that we need to be kind to our enemies....or we can't use these weapons because they are inhumane......or we can't starve them into submission because....but what about the children!!!

The US foreign policy when it comes these ass backwards terroristic countries just makes me sick. I wish we would adopt the warfighting doctrine of medieval times, we don't just win wars, we destroy your country, your culture, your civilization and all its history that goes with it. Your country belongs to us now. No more of this giving back nonsense and installing a leader we're only gonna have to take out in a couple of years.

50 states aren't enough. We need more. We need to start expanding our country.

 

[Glomer]

Why the paranoia? I think we need more anti-American statements in this country. You guys don't have to apologize - just say them.

and for that statement I reward you a trip to any other country other than ours..........Send me an email in a few years and tell me how anti-american you are.

As my grandfather told my extreme left wing brother once......."you can disagree, but god dammit love and support this country or get the hell out!"

 

[Habanero]

What I don't understand is that a few of those countries have UN sanction violations, yet we support them. I don't see us cutting any of the other countries off and taking action against them, even though they use car bombs and other "terrorist" acts against neighboring countries.

Saddam is a sad little man, but his son is much worse.. I'd want to think twice about asking for a regime change.. especially if his son takes power.


Otherwise, El Guapo is my pick, I'm sure if he'd have gotten his way though, as I heard from many troops that come back, they wish they would've gotten that chance then..

 

[Runner]

50 states aren't enough. We need more. We need to start expanding our country.

I'm not sure if I agree with this thought, but lets run with it anyway.

Planning the new Iraq:
No single use zoning.
Urban growth boundaries.
No Highway Department lets have a real Dept. of Transportation that can think beyond the automobile.
Emphasis on transit (Bus, Trolley, Trains)
Re-think public art, the crossed swords just doesn't work for me.
Parliamentary Government

What else can we add to the list?

 

[Repo Man]

Why the paranoia? I think we need more anti-American statements in this country. You guys don't have to apologize - just say them.

Hmm I really like how you "quoted" someone but changed the quote. I believe the original quote said "critical statements" not "Anti-American statements." They are two totally different things. If you criticize the government of the US you are not Anti-American. If that was the case, every single conservative who criticized Clinton would be Anti-American.

Criticizing the government is actually as American of an activity as you can do. In some countries criticizing the policies of the government will get you killed. Here in america it sparks debate. People make critical comments about the government because they want to make America better. For some people, peaceful confilct resolution instead of war is their idea of an ideal America, not an anti-American statement. My earlier comment criticizing American refusal to sign key environmental agreements was not anti-American, but rather an opinion that if we, as one of the largest contributors to world pollution, would cooperate with others on some issues (environment), they may cooperate with us (removal of Saddam).

 

[prudence]

Kill em all I say!! All the liberals too!!

No seriously, I blame alot of this on us. We never finished the job during Desert Storm because the American public 99.9% of whom have never served a day in their life in military say that we need to be kind to our enemies....or we can't use these weapons because they are inhumane......or we can't starve them into submission because....but what about the children!!!

I never served, and probably will never serve, in the US military. Ass kickings are sometimes a necessary part of life. Kid A (Iraq) will beat up Kid B (Kuwait) until Kid C (US) comes along to kick Kid A's ass. Kid B will do whatever Kid C wants becuase it Kid A's ass...what's the point of being the big kid on the block if you can't use your size once in a while. The UN is like the teacher supervising the playground; physically located in the area, but doesn't see or do anything.

 

[Glomer]

Hmmmm...something funny is going on.

I coppied and pasted the quote onto my reply........is it possible that the original quote was some how changed???????? could this be a conspiracy against all garage logic, common sense conservatives??????

 

[Chet]

Let's send Lee Greenwood to Iraq. He can be the Pied Piper of a new era.

I'm so sick of that damned "Proud to be an American" song....

 

[Chet]

Hmmmm...something funny is going on.

I coppied and pasted the quote onto my reply........is it possible that the original quote was some how changed???????? could this be a conspiracy against all garage logic, common sense conservatives??????

Moderators and Super Moderators (and Dan) have the Power Of Edit. I doubt however, that any one of us would use those Powers for evil.....

 

[Chet]

I never served, and probably will never serve, in the US military.

Was it the flat feet or the missing testacles that kept you out of the military?

 

[Tranplanner]

Editorial Cartoon from todays Globe and Mail...

 

[Dan]

Disagreeing with an element of U.S. policy is in itself not Anti-American. "Question Authority" is a distinctly American trait.

However, many in the progressive camp take the stance that EVERYTHING the United States does is wrong. An example is when we get involved as a third party somewhere in the world; the side we talk is always the wrong side to them.

Let's look at Afghanistan . Before the WTC attack, many US progressives urged action against the oppressive Taliban regime, for their oppression of women and non-Muslims. When we acted, though, the protests began ... because we were now taking action. It's now a "racist war," a "war against Islam," an example of not taking the perceived high road of pacifism. The fact that women were "liberated" (to the extent that they were) and that the brutal oppression fo the Taliban ended wasn't an issue. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

In the minds of many progressives, we (being the US) always choose the wrong side in which oppressive regimes we support. (As if we should be supporting any of them, but still ...) Family of Saud bad. (Oppression of women!) Saddam Hussein good. (Poor, starving Iraq.) China bad. (Free Tibet!) Cuba good. (Viva Che! Viva Fidel! Viva la revolucion!) I can't explain it, except as anti-Americanism for its own sake, almost a political fashion statement among a certain crowd.

Now, the conservatives that use the word "liberal" to label ALL liberals as having a certain mindset, as if everyone whose mindset that runs left of center thinks and acts alike ... read between the lines. The conception that some conservatives not have of liberals isn't much different than the oft-held belief that all blacks think alike." What difference is there between "Liberals don't want to take action against Iraq" and "Blacks celebrated O.J. Simpson's verdict of innocence"?

Liberal media? What, the editorial pages in the New York Times and Thursday urban alternative freesheets are dominant media forces? NPR isn't even liberal ... just having a liberal audience doesn't mean they have a liberal slant. Listen closely. I think far more people own AM radios than those that subscribe to the Times. Consider the corporate ownership of broadcast media and most newspapers. Think they're spouting out leftist propaganda? Sorry, righties, but it's all a myth..

I'll admit to plagarism on this next sentece, but it says it better than I could. It will be a cold day in hell when see Cockburn or Pollitt sparring with Will on ``This Week with David Brinkley,'' or read Chomsky's writings in the New York Times, or hear Jerry Brown's talk program carried on as many radio stations as Rush Limbaugh's. This is why all the conservative sputtering about ``the liberal media'' is a cruel joke that's being played on the American news consumer. The Right's agenda is upheld virtually everywhere in the mainstream media, and has been for years.

"I admit it : The liberal media were never that powerful and the whole thing was often used as an excuse by conservatives for conservative failures."
William Kristol

"I've gotten balanced coverage and broad coverage - all we could have asked. ... For heaven sakes, we kid about the liberal media, but every republican on earth does that."
Pat Buchanan

"Repetition is the lynchpin of propaganda."
Joseph Gobbels

 

[NHPlanner]

Hmmmm...something funny is going on.

I coppied and pasted the quote onto my reply........is it possible that the original quote was some how changed???????? could this be a conspiracy against all garage logic, common sense conservatives??????

Original posters can also edit their posts. If the original poster edited after you cut and paste, you'd see a difference. Also, us mods typically will let you know when we edit or moderate something.

Now, lets avoid turning this into a flame fest, and return to playing nice about war.

 

[Dan]

Was it the flat feet or the missing testacles that kept you out of the military?

Yellow card. Let's not get personal, folks.

 

[Chet]

Yellow card. Let's not get personal, folks.

HeeHee, yeah I can walk the 8 feet to his office if I want to.... this was just sooo much more fun.

 

[Planderella]

Let's send Lee Greenwood to Iraq. He can be the Pied Piper of a new era.

I'm so sick of that damned "Proud to be an American" song....

Hey!!! That song is putting his kids through college!

 

[el Guapo]

I'd love to go again.

Send El Guapo with a rifle and a scope.

They did once already.

Dan - Do I get points for being nice in this thread?

 

[Chet]

Re: I'd love to go again.

They did once already.

Dan - Do I get points for being nice in this thread?

I give you points for staying ON TOPIC!

 

[el Guapo]

My take.

You comment about not finishing the job can be traced right back to President George Bush and current members of this administration that didn't finish the job in 1991 when they could have removed Saddam.

That's a bit absurd - How many pinkos would have shat their pants if when we were through killing the Republican Guard we took a left and took out Bagdad? Can't have it both ways Mr.

Folks: We are a target. Even the peaceniks are a target. Evil don't discriminate between Hawk and Dove. Its the body count that counts to these folks. We stand for things these people hate. We will wake up one day and an American or UK city will either be smoking or dead from some hell bug. Stephen King's first few chapters of the Stand are no long the stuff of speculation - these possibilities are real.

 

[prudence]

Military personnel...

There is a long history of my immediate relatives serving their country during various wars / conflicts the US has been involved in this century... And I am pretty sure that one of my uncles has caused a couple conflicts (from his role with Ratheon) in the Middle East. He was sitting four seats from Anwar Sadat when he was shot...it seems everytime my uncle would leave a country and war would erupt: Saudi, Lebannon, Israel, Kuwait, Iran, Iraq...

WWI - Great-grandfather
WWII - Grandfather
Korea - Great-Uncle
Vietnam - Father / Uncle
Any issue involving the US and the Middle East since 1970 - Uncle


The military was NOT an option for me. The desire was for me to go to college.

I am quite thankful and respectful of all those individuals who have served and FOUGHT for this Country. I will ALWAYS support the military to my fullest ability.

 

[el Guapo]

Re: Military personnel...

The military was NOT an option for me. The desire was for me to go to college.

For me and many others it was the morgage of our lives to the military that paid for our college. I am the third generation to get an education as a result of service. As a veteran I don't believe you have to have served in the military to have a valid opinion one way or the other on this issue. But I do believe you should have your facts straight and have given this issue serious consideration. Disagreeing with the government is your right and your duty.

Moving on....America has almost always taken the sucker punch in history and then reacted. Since the Russians developed the H-Bomb the potenial sucker punch has had the posibility of being fatal.

On September 10, 2001 we never thought they could take four planes and kill 21/2 targets and 3000 people. What if the next strike is an order or two of magnitude above the last? How many nukes are the Russians, Kazikstanis and Chechians missing? Don't know do you? They are not going to tell you about 100 nukes are missing - not presumed destoyed. What if it is 16 planes with 16 nukes hitting 16 American cities? Would America as we know it know survive? I don't think so. We would then be in the dust pan of history and so would more than 15 Million people is my guess and all the weak counties would have to live in a neighborhood with out a cop.

We have to hunt the hunters.

 

[Jeff]

Ah the old Russian Nuke stories. Learned all about that one when I was in NBC school. What people don't realize when they say "How can a nuke be missing" is that these aren't the 10 or 20 megaton jobbies, the ones on trailers. These are the 1 megaton manpacks that are missing. Not enough firepower to probably take out a city block, but big enough to cause fear and panic like none of us have ever witnessed before. These things are bad, and the scary thing is, one of these bad boys is going to go off in some major US city soon.

Also a little tid bit I learned in NBC school. Stay away from the public buffets. Like the kind out Taco Bell, Old Country Buffett, you know the type. Pretty easy way to introduce a biological agent into the public.

 

[el Guapo]

1 megaton in Oakland Fl - A town we all love and have gotten to know this last year -but hardly on anyone's terror list.

12 psi Radius: 1.7 miles
[Note: The outside edge of this shaded area represents the 12 psi (pound per square inch) ring. Blast pressure within the ring is greater than 12 psi; blast pressure outside the ring is less than 12 psi.]
At the center of the ring lies a crater 200 feet deep and 1000 feet in diameter. The rim of this crater is 1,000 feet wide and is composed of highly radioactive soil and debris. Nothing recognizable remains within about 3,200 feet (0.6 miles) from the center, except, perhaps, the remains of some buildings' foundations. At 1.7 miles, only some of the strongest buildings -- those made of reinforced, poured concrete -- are still standing. Ninety-eight percent of the population in this area are dead.
5 psi Radius: 2.7 miles
Virtually everything is destroyed between the 12 and 5 psi rings. The walls of typical multi-story buildings, including apartment buildings, have been completely blown out. The bare, structural skeletons of more and more buildings rise above the debris as you approach the 5 psi ring. Single-family residences within this this area have been completely blown away -- only their foundations remain. Fifty percent of the population between the 12 and 5 psi rings are dead. Forty percent are injured.
2 psi Radius: 4.7 miles
Any single-family residences that have not been completely destroyed are heavily damaged. The windows of office buildings have been blown away, as have some of their walls. The contents of these buildings' upper floors, including the people who were working there, are scattered on the street. A substantial amount of debris clutters the entire area. Five percent of the population between the 5 and 2 psi rings are dead. Forty-five percent are injured.
1 psi Radius: 7.4 miles
Residences are moderately damaged. Commercial buildings have sustained minimal damage. Twenty-five percent of the population between the 2 and 1 psi rings have been injured, mainly by flying glass and debris. Many others have been injured from thermal radiation -- the heat generated by the blast. The remaining seventy-five percent are unhurt.


NOTE: This information has been drawn mainly from "The Effects of Nuclear War" (Washington: Office of Technology Assessment, Congress of the United States, 1979). The zones of destruction mapped out on this page are broad generalizations and do not take into account factors such as weather and geography of the target.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/bomb/sfeature/mapablast.html

In reality a demo nuke as you refer to has a far lower yield.

 

[Tom R]

W

This "Trust me" BS is too much like LBJ and the Gulf of Tonkin incident which resulted in giving me a year-long paid tour of sunny southeast Asia. Excuse me if I'm distrustful of the pres and synical, but I am. When you consider war be comitted to accept and justify a lot of body bags. The US has been both skillful and lucky in its last several military "excursions" and I credit this to Colin Powel who apparantly learned his lesson. I hope both skill and luck hold out. Just make sure the loss of all the people you're putting at risk is worth it.

 

[Runner]

The military was NOT an option for me. The desire was for me to go to college.

They're not mutually exclusive, many of us did both...

I will ALWAYS support the military to my fullest ability.

But you're support is appreciated none the less.

 

[el Guapo]

Parsing the sentence

Supporting the military and supporting W's foreign policy are two completely different things and should remain seperate points of debate. I just wish people like Mr. & Mrs. Susan Sarandon knew that.

Woody Harrelson Sucks! ha ha ha

 

[prudence]

They're not mutually exclusive, many of us did both...

My family did not want me to follow in their footsteps (not that I was necessarily looking to do so)...and the call to play a collegiate sport was too great for me to ignore...

I believe that while you may not agree with a specific course of foriegn policy decision, you should support those involved in the action resulting from the decision. Soldiers follow orders. Criticize the decision-makeres, but support the men and women who must carry out the decisions made.

 

[Habanero]

Prudence? You played Dutch Women's Rugby?


WOW!

 

[Chet]

Prudence? You played Dutch Women's Rugby?


WOW!

Oh gawd, I wish I had photoshop! nerudite, nhplanner, EG! A little help?

 

[prudence]

Prudence? You played Dutch Women's Rugby?


WOW!

For two days...until I saw that my teammates needed a jock more than I did...

 

[Chet]

For two days...until I saw that my teammates needed a jock more than I did...

Dan - see? That supports (no pun intended) the post I did earlier in reference to the cojones....

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

 

[Habanero]

I get no points for this-

Who needs photoshop?

http://www.damesrugby.nl/gallery/belluno/nedteam8.jpg

 

[el Guapo]

The Horror

[ot]Yeah - What if Sadam got ahold of Dutch Women' Rugby or DWR as Dick Cheney says?[/ot]

"An errand boy, sent by the grocery clerk, to collect the bill"

 

[Jeff]

My family did not want me to follow in their footsteps (not that I was necessarily looking to do so)...and the call to play a collegiate sport was too great for me to ignore...

I did the Marine Corps, College, Nationally-ranked college rugby team, and the Marine Corps rugby team. All at once. It was alot though.

Prudence, there is no need to make excuses for not going into the military. You chose not too, I as well as most, will not look down at you. Quite frankly, I think the military would be better off without those who didn't want to be there. All they do is cause problems, get people hurt, etc.